Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #406
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Fri, 10 Dec 93 11:13:18 EST

Linux-Misc Digest #406, Volume #1                Fri, 10 Dec 93 11:13:18 EST

Contents:
  Re: Linux counter: Usage growth of Linux (Arthur van Leeuwen)
  Re: How to send mail to COMPUSERVE (Louis J. LaBash Jr.)
  Re: Who is the typical Linux user? (Harald T. Alvestrand)
  diamond viper vlb/xfree 2.0 (Stefan Wolfrum)
  Re: Morse Telecom & JANA (was Re: Special: Linux on CD-ROM or Disk, $29.99 (Expires 12/1) (gordon@tradenet.tradenet.com)
  Re: Why is comp.os.linux still around? (W.R.Volz)
  Re: (Was: <sys/param.h> BUG ) -- report WHERE? (Peter Dalgaard SFE)
  Re: <sys/param.h> BUG (Tilo Schuerer)
  Re: Who is the typical Linux user? (Dan Mattrazzo)
  Re: Modem problems... (Lloyd Miller)
  Re: JANA CD Problems. (Nhut Nguyen)
  Re: Yet another benchmark results.. (Gilles Gagnon)
  Re: Yet another benchmark results.. (Todd Walk)
  Re: Security (Dan Mattrazzo)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: arthurvl@sci.kun.nl (Arthur van Leeuwen)
Subject: Re: Linux counter: Usage growth of Linux
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1993 09:20:22 GMT

In <Dec.9.10.12.15.1993.10464@pilot.njin.net> dblack@pilot.njin.net (David Alan Black) writes:

>But it's an interesting question.  Not that this is a scientifically correct
>way to conduct a survey, but....  have people had the experience of giving
>Linux to non-internet-connected friends, and having them actually install
>and use it?  Just curious.

I did. I gave him a pretty complete slackware 1.1.0. He hasn't installed
it at home as of yet, because he simply doesn't have a 386 handy,
but he's using the bootdisk that was included to fool around at the
386 at his school.

Bye,

--
    <>      <>  Arthur van Leeuwen
   <><>    <>   arthurvl@sci.kun.nl
  <>--<>  <>      Schizofrenia is a way of life, 
 <>    <><><><    not a mind disease.

------------------------------

From: lou@minuet.siue.edu (Louis J. LaBash Jr. )
Subject: Re: How to send mail to COMPUSERVE
Date: 10 Dec 1993 08:56:11 -0500
Reply-To: lou@minuet.siue.edu (Louis J. LaBash Jr. )

Hi,
[deleted..]
|xxxxxx.yyyy@compuserve.com
[deleted...]

Note: Compuserve as well as most other e-mail addresses have a postmaster
      alias.

Therefore  postmaster@compuserve.com  works.  *Try-it*

Louis-ljl-

------------------------------

From: hta@uninett.no (Harald T. Alvestrand)
Subject: Re: Who is the typical Linux user?
Date: 10 Dec 1993 14:01:23 GMT

Current usage pattern of Linux, based on the Linux Counter:

PLACES WHERE LINUX IS USED
==========================
 Self Other   Sum %Sum  Place
 2351    25  2376  55% home
    9     1    10   0% home, school
  837     2   839  19% home, work
    1     0     1   0% home, work, school
   52     0    52   1% not used
    1     1     2   0% school
  226   508   734  17% somewhere
  254    12   266   6% work
    1     0     1   0% work, school
==========================
 3732   549  4281 100% TOTAL

(I will improve upon this layout!)

I read this as 74 % home, 25 % at work, 17 % replied something else.
Note that there are more than 250 users who *only* use it at work, out
of my 4000 registered ones!

-- 
                   Harald Tveit Alvestrand
                Harald.T.Alvestrand@uninett.no
      G=Harald;I=T;S=Alvestrand;O=uninett;P=uninett;C=no
                      +47 73 59 70 94
My son's name is Torbjxrn. The letter between "j" and "r" is o with a slash.
     Register with the Linux Counter! E-mail to linux-counter@uninett.no!

------------------------------

From: wolfrum@uran.informatik.uni-bonn.de (Stefan Wolfrum)
Subject: diamond viper vlb/xfree 2.0
Date: 10 Dec 1993 12:48:10 GMT
Reply-To: wolfrum@uran.informatik.uni-bonn.de


Hi!


I have a DIAMOND VIPER VLB w/ 2MB VRAM, which has a Weitek P9000
chip on it.
I recently received Linux 0.99p13 and the new XFree86 2.0 XWindow
Server.

Does anybody know something about this combination and how to support
the VIPER with XFree?

Has anybody already developed a driver for the VIPER?


Please mail me at wolfrum@uran.informatik.uni-bonn.de

Thanx in advance,
Stefan.





------------------------------

From: gordon@tradenet.tradenet.com
Subject: Re: Morse Telecom & JANA (was Re: Special: Linux on CD-ROM or Disk, $29.99 (Expires 12/1)
Date: 9 Dec 1993 20:53:10 -0000

Michael R. Johnston (mjohnsto@ditdah.Morse.Net) wrote:
: Alex Freed (freed@europa.orion.adobe.com) wrote:

: : Please everybody have in mind that this is the infamous JANA CDROM under a
: : new name. There was a post a few days ago from Jay/Jana saying that Morse is
: : taking over their distribution.
: : BTW my disk arrived too - also in a broken jewel box, unmarked and grossly
: : out of date. Looks like they decided to just complete the subscribtions with
: : SOMETHING - as cheap as possible.
: : I did actually like the very first CDROM from them - it was the only low cost
: : Linux CDROM at the time, but now ... enough said.

: Folks, please remember that Morse Telecommunications is not affiliated with
: JANA in any way other than that we now exclusively distribute their Linux 
: product and specify the contents. Additionally, we provide technical support 
: for this product which was previously unavailable. 

: I believe that we provide a high level of service and support and offer 
: excellent value to the customer. Our recently announced Linux Quarterly 
: ($79/year for 4 Linux CD's) continues this trend. I think the multitude of
: folks who've used our technical support service would agree with what I'm
: saying here. We certainly don't turn our backs on anyone, and even take
: quite a number of calls from folks who've bought their CD's from other
: companies.

: I'm digressing too much, though. The purpose of this is just to say that
: Morse Telecom is *not* JANA. Please do not equate the problems associated
: with them to our company. I personally invite ANY disattisfied customer
: of JANA's to contact me. Tell me your problem. I will attempt to resolve
: it with them directly. If they cannot resolve the issue, Morse Telecom
: will make good on their promise. If this requires sending you a replacement
: CD *AT OUR COST*, then we'll do it. 

OK, Michael ! I've phoned Jay today. I hope he sends me                
the CD's. I've totally wasted enough time on this and the money I've sent.
If I dont' get the CD's I've been promised I will go farther. LAST CHANCE !

 

------------------------------

From: hwrvo@usho42.hou281.chevron.com (W.R.Volz)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: Why is comp.os.linux still around?
Date: 10 Dec 93 14:34:37 GMT

Ok. So I was wrong. Big deal.

In article <CHsGB9.D5A@greenie.muc.de>, gert@greenie.muc.de (Gert Doering) writes:
|> hwrvo@usho42.hou281.chevron.com (W.R.Volz) writes:
|> 
|> >You can't make this news group go away, unless there is something about
|> >the news server that I don't know (which is quite possible). All the
|> >other C.O.L news groups are rooted in this one. The actual articles are
|> >stored in directories that are formed by replacing the '.' with a '/'.
|> 
|> Rubbish. Even if a upper level directory exists, it still has to be in the
|> "active" file for articles to go there. If you remove c.o.l from "active", 
|> all articles posted there will go to "junk".
|> 
|> gert
|> -- 
|> I've got a signature breakdown! Anybody got a spare one?
|> 
|> Gert Doering - Munich, Germany                             gert@greenie.muc.de
|> fax: +49-89-3243328                         gert.doering@physik.tu-muenchen.de

-- 

======================
Bill Volz
Chevron Petroleum Technology Co.
Earth Model/Interpretation & Analysis Division.
P.O. Box 42832, Houston, TX, 77242-2832
Phone: (713) 596-2059 Fax: (713) 596-3009

------------------------------

From: pd@kubism.ku.dk (Peter Dalgaard SFE)
Subject: Re: (Was: <sys/param.h> BUG ) -- report WHERE?
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1993 13:58:12 GMT

In <1993Dec10.111506.25078@ucl.ac.uk> ucjtrjf@ucl.ac.uk (Jonny Farringdon) writes:

>I don't know who to send a bug report to. If this is the right place please
>do not let me know ;-)

But please let the rest of us know! I reported a similar quirk
in an include file a while back, but saw no response whatsoever.
Obviously, the Slackware maintainer is not the right person
but is it be the kernel hackers that should be told??

--
   O_   ---- Peter Dalgaard
  c/ /'  --- Statistical Research Unit
 ( ) \( ) -- University of Copenhagen
~~~~~~~~~~ - (pd@kubism.ku.dk)

------------------------------

From: tilo@cs.tu-berlin.de (Tilo Schuerer)
Subject: Re: <sys/param.h> BUG
Date: 10 Dec 1993 15:10:11 GMT

In article <1993Dec10.111506.25078@ucl.ac.uk>, ucjtrjf@ucl.ac.uk (Jonny Farringdon) writes:
> 
> The include file
> 
> /usr/include/sys/param.h
> 
> defined MAXPATHLEN as the *string* PATH_MAX
> 
> Rather than an integer value (like 512?). Clearly PATH_MAX should have had a
> value, but is doesn't (at least in mine) so the string gets substuted
> instead.
> 
> Discovered this when compiling the Stutgard Neural Net Simulator (billed as
> compiling Under Linux for 386 machines). Jonny.




I had exactly the same problem and "solved" it by editing
xgui/sources/ui_main.c and including the header file <sys/limits.h>.

There PATH_MAX is definend. After doing this xgui compiles fine!


Hope this helps,

Tilo

------------------------------

From: dcm6986@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Dan Mattrazzo)
Subject: Re: Who is the typical Linux user?
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1993 14:11:06 GMT

In article <1993Dec8.075739.11499@fylz.com>, phil@fylz.com (Phil Hughes LJ Editor) writes:
>Our publisher is attempting to put together a profile of a typical
>Linux user.  I keep attempting to tell him there is no such thing
>as a typical one.  Below is my guess at what the Linux community
  [ ... ]
>Today I see the majority of Linux users as people who have at least
>some Unix experience.  Most are fairly technical and ranging in
>background from students to Unix systems programmers.  Many of
>these people are work with a "real" Unix system at work and have
>a Linux box at home.  And some of those people are attempting to
>convince people at work that Linux would be a reasonable alternative
>to a commercial system for some work-related tasks.  The remainder
>of this population is the MS-DOS hacker that has seen Linux as
>a chance to run a real operating system without even having to
>change computers.

        The above describes me; I'm a student who uses UNIX at school
        _AND_ I'm a messy-DOS person who is looking for a REAL OS
        (though I do already have OS/2, more power is always better :) )

>In one to two years I think the population will be much less technical
>with tens of thousands of people moving from MS-DOS to Linux
>because Linux offers more functionality and at a lower cost.
>Some of these people won't really know much about Linux itself but
>will pick it because it will do their job.  
        [ ... ]

>-- 
>Phil Hughes, Editor, Linux Journal, P.O. Box 85867, Seattle, WA 98145-1867 USA
>E-mail: phil@fylz.com   Phone: +1 206 524 8338 FAX: +1 206 526 0803

        Now THIS is where is see you might be getting off track.  I
        beg to differ with your assumption that Linux is _less_ technical
        than MS-DOS.  Yes, the communinity may be getting less technical,
        and Linux has more to offer, but do think your mother or your 
        10 year old could install and administer Linux on thier own?

        Once again, yes the _LARGE_ majority of Linux users are technical
        and have a good deal of computer knowledege _NOW_, but unless Linux
        evolves (alot) into an install and forget system like MS-DOS is,
        then I don't see this happening.  And I think this also has alot
        to do with just the fact that it's UNIX, and you've got privs,
        shell scripts, Xconfigs, etc.

        But you wanted opinion and this is mine. :)

=============================================================================== 
        Dan Mattrazzo                           
        dcmfac@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
        
        Mastering that Parallel thing  
        Graduate Studies
        Computer Science
        Rochester Institute of Technology

------------------------------

From: lloyd@lfmcal.cuc.ab.ca (Lloyd Miller)
Subject: Re: Modem problems...
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1993 10:14:01 GMT

Matt Womer (matt@csc.albany.edu) wrote:
> I've been having a few problems with my modem since I purchased a new
> machine (I had a 486/50 and bought a 486/66).  I used to never have
> problems with it until the new machine.  It's the same modem with the
> same software setup (okay, a few kernel revisions later, but
> basically the same).  But now-a-days whenever I'm using the modem I
> lose characters whenever the hard drive runs.  It's especially
> annoying under term because everything locks up while term tries to
> retransmit.  I thought it was the new IDE controller, so I swapped
> with the one on the 486/50, but I still have the same problem.  They
> are the old uarts and I am running at 14.4...  but why would this
> problem not happen on the 486/50?

I am guessing that interrupt response could be better on a 50 Mhz due
to the faster memory cycles. The dx2/66 runs main memory cycles at 33
Mhz. All the stack operations of interrupt service for both disk and
serial might bottleneck on memory access. Do you have a 16550 serial
port for your modem? If this guess is accurate, the UART FIFOs could
cure your problem.
-- 
 Lloyd Miller, Calgary                  Don't flame on my tirade.
 lloyd@lfmcal.cuc.ab.ca
 Lloyd_Miller@f57.n17.z1.fidonet.org

------------------------------

From: nnhut@bnr.ca (Nhut Nguyen)
Subject: Re: JANA CD Problems.
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1993 13:39:03 GMT

In <60.3733.5780.0N18DC0C@canrem.com> jana@canrem.com (Jana) writes:

>Hello All,


>I have a 800 number which you can call. Flame me after you have talked
>to me. Before you write some thing on the net, think ? you are not
>just typing but you are hurting others.   I dont undertand why people
>dont call on 800 numbers. Dont you know that these numbers are free.:-)

Did you publish your 800 number? And what if someone calls but nobody
answer? You told people to use your E-mail, and people get blamed that
it is not working and it is THEIR fault to use it.

Before you think that others are hurting you, put your feet into
those of a subscriber who get promises, promises and nothing else
after sending you his/her check. Your service is good only it is timely.
Some subscribers still have not received their July/Aug issue and now
it is Dec. Look at your service and think again before complaining
that someone is hurting you. Don't use arguments such as it is cheap etc.
to avoid complaints about your lousy service. And also watch the net: 
how many complaints you got so far?  It is NOT ONLY from one person,
but from all over the world.

>any more I am doing very well on other CD market. Watch for our ads on
>next weeks PC Mag for other CD products.

With this attitude, I doubt that you will be doing well when competition
catchs up......

>Bye
Have a nice day!

>Jay
--
Nhut Nguyen              InterNet:  nnhut@bnr.ca | My 0.02$ + GST + PST
BNR Ltd., Ottawa, Canada                         | Opinions are mine.

------------------------------

From: gilles@dgbt.doc.ca (Gilles Gagnon)
Subject: Re: Yet another benchmark results..
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 93 15:14:31 GMT

In article <2e81gs$40@renux.frmug.fr.net>, rene@renux.frmug.fr.net (Rene COUGNENC) writes:
|> Ce brave Carl Boernecke ecrit:
|> 
|> > I don't like your benchmark!  Waaaahhh!  Took a total of 4109
|> > seconds on my 386/33 (without 387) and 8 MB of RAM.  Yes, the
|> 
|> Yes. I tried it on my 486/33 8Mb RAM 8Mb swap, Linux 0.99pl14, AND RUNNING
|> X11 and a few Xterm's.  This is a common situation when running programs.
|> 
|> The machine seemed to be stopped !
|> I had to reboot after 45 minutes, could not wait more than that whitout
|> being able to move the mouse or type a character :-((
|> 
|> (Without X, the bench worked fine and printed 73 seconds ).
|> 

Well, I gave this benchmark program a try on my 386sx16 with 387sx co-processor.
Here are the specifics of the machine and the results.

Machine:
        386sx16 + 387sx
        10MB RAM
        Two 16MB swap partitions (32MB)
        Slackware 1.1.0

Results:
        - Single user: 310 seconds
        - X11 with 4 xterms each running the program: approx. 1300 secs.
          As one could expect, lots of swapping (~24MB worth). It was 
          neat to check the swap space usage increase.

Maybe I should look into getting a faster machine now.

-- 
Gilles Gagnon     gilles@dgbt.doc.ca      | The Communications Research Centre
                                          | 3701 Carling Avenue, Ottawa CANADA

------------------------------

From: walk@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu (Todd Walk)
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware,comp.os.vms,comp.benchmarks,relcom.talk,relcom.fido.su.general
Subject: Re: Yet another benchmark results..
Date: 10 Dec 1993 15:45:49 GMT

viznyuk@mps.ohio-state.edu (Dragon Fly) writes:

>    Notwithstanding possible critique from alleged
>computer specialists the insightful observer might note
>that the "benchmark" code is pretty typical for scientific
>calculations. Whatever other merits the system might have,
>if it's dragging its feet on this test it means the system
>from the point of view of consumer [insightful observer] is
>a crap. As many insightful observers probably have already
>noticed, the crap is being limited mainly to two mainstreams:
>SUN Sparcs and DECs running VMS.

Well I'm not an "alleged computer specialists", I'm a PhD.
candidate at UTK, and I'm in agreement with the others that
say that your benchmark is "crap".

Inaccuarate benchmarking is easy.
Accuarate benchmarking is something that the Federal Government
spends millions of $$$ on for grants to university professors
who then work for YEARS refining test suites.

(At UTK here Jack Dongarra does a lot of work on benchmark programs,
esp. Linpack.  He's one of those million $$$ professors.
Take a good look a Linpack and then compare it to your little
code blurb, then if you're still interrested come back
with a new, more reasonable program.)


--
                                        Todd Walk
                                        walk@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu


------------------------------

From: dcm6986@ritvax.isc.rit.edu (Dan Mattrazzo)
Subject: Re: Security
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1993 14:36:10 GMT

In article <2e7i9eINN2tck@rs1.rrz.Uni-Koeln.DE>, truemper@fileserv1.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE (Winfried Truemper) writes:
>In article <2e53si$hbk@jacobs.jacobs.mn.org>, root@jacobs.mn.org (Mike Horwath) writes:
>|> Mathias Koerber (mathias@solomon.technet.sg) wrote:
  [ ... ]
>|> : I want to protect the system against booting from floppy (not actually bad in
>|> : itself) or moreover against other prople mounting the root filesystem
>|> : from other OS'es they boot.
>|> 
>|> this can be accomplished with current AMI bios' by setting a password to
>|> get into the bios and YOU set the bios to boot off of C: and ignore A:
>|> for booting.  Should be in the Advanced CMOS settings.
>|> 
>|> --
>Hi folks,
>
>its really useless to upgrade the bios in order to get the bios protected
>since there is a DOS program called "amisetup". The program allows reading 
>and changing every entry in the CMOS-RAM very comfortabel, even the 
>password.

        BUT the person wouldn't be able to run that program because
        1.  it's not on the hard disk which the machine boots to.
        2.  the machine won't be booting a floppy
        Besides even to run the program you need to be "in" the computer
        which means you need to get past the BIOS password.

        I think the larger issue of BIOS protection, is just to 
        understand that with enough time, someone could open the case,
        disconnect the battery, and the CMOS would be gone (after a hour
        or two, some less, some more).  Then the person could boot w/o
        a password.  

        But this all depends on just how vulnerable your machine is 
        physically.  As someone pointed out before, the only way to 
        have 99% certainty it to put it in a locked room.

=============================================================================== 
        Dan Mattrazzo                           
        dcmfac@ritvax.isc.rit.edu
        
        Mastering that Parallel thing  
        Graduate Studies
        Computer Science
        Rochester Institute of Technology

------------------------------


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