Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #793
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Thu, 10 Mar 94 08:13:10 EST

Linux-Misc Digest #793, Volume #1                Thu, 10 Mar 94 08:13:10 EST

Contents:
  Re: Mosaic 2.2 problems (Jack Coyote)
  Can't start Nascent X on ET4000 (Rich Skrenta)
  Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering") (John F. Haugh II)
  STRAW POLL: Linux groups automonitoring (Ron "Asbestos" Dippold)
  Re: SoftPC/Linux? (Mr. Bassman)
  Re: Mosaic 2.2 problems (Doug McIntyre)
  Re: lost /lib/libc.so.4 (Ron Smits)
  Re: [grep] please replicate (Mr. Bassman)
  Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering") (Tim Smith)
  I'm developing UMSDOS Linux Pkg. (Whitstler)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: uphrrmk@gemini.oscs.montana.edu (Jack Coyote)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help
Subject: Re: Mosaic 2.2 problems
Date: 9 Mar 1994 17:22:26 GMT
Reply-To: uphrrmk@gemini.oscs.montana.edu (Jack Coyote)

In comp.os.linux.misc, jonb@specialix.com (Jon Brawn) writes:

[xposted and redirected to c.o.l.help]

>1) I can't type into forms which are embedded in hypertext documents
>   [I can paste into them from though]. I assume I haven't installed something
>   somewhere...

  This is a bug in Motif 1.2  (See posts in c.o.l.help)

  It has been known for some time, but no one has compiled with the fixed
  libraries.


>2) When Mosaic is doing network transfers it uses select() with a timeval to
>   cause a short delay, so that the spinning globe and flowing data icon works
>   nicely - regrettably, Linux's select behaves differently to everyone elses,
>   and so the timeval struct gets decremented to zero, and so when Mosaic is
>  waiting for a transfer from somewhere, it consumes 100% of the cpu by drawing
>   the spinning globe.

  RTFM

  This can be turned off by an X resource, for more, click
<a href=http://www.ncsa.uiuc.edu/SDG/Software/Mosaic/Docs/resources.html>here</a>

-- 
 " ... think about how stupid the average person is, and then realize that
       half of them are stupider than *that*!"
  
                                                -- George Carlin

------------------------------

From: skrenta@summit.novell.com (Rich Skrenta)
Subject: Can't start Nascent X on ET4000
Date: 9 Mar 94 03:15:57 GMT

I'm running Linux from the Nascent CD-ROM distribution, and I can't
get X to stay up.  The X screen comes up (with a working pointer), but
quickly dies and goes away with "client error".  Thanks in advance for
any help you can give me.

Here is the log:

# startx

XFree86 Version 1.3 / X Window System
(protocol Version 11, revision 0, vendor release 5000)
Operating System: Linux 
Configured drivers:
  VGA256 (256 colour SVGA):
      et4000, et3000, pvga1, wd90c00, wd90c10, wd90c30, gvga, ati,
      tvga8800cs, tvga8900b, tvga8900c, tvga8900cl, tvga9000, clgd5420,
      clgd5422, clgd5424, clgd5426, ncr77c22, ncr77c22e, cpq_avga
(using VT number 5)

Xconfig: /usr/X386/lib/X11/Xconfig
Mouse: type: Microsoft, device: /dev/ttys1, baudrate: 1200,
       samplerate: 150
FontPath set to "/usr/X386/lib/X11/fonts/misc/,/usr/X386/lib/X11/fonts/Type1/,/usr/X386/lib/X11/fonts/Speedo/,/usr/X386/lib/X11/fonts/75dpi/"
VGA256: et4000 (mem: 1024k numclocks: 8)
VGA256:   clocks:  25.00  14.00  32.00  36.00  40.00  45.00  56.00  65.00
VGA256: Option "hibit_high"
VGA256: Mode "1024x768i": mode clock =  45.000, clock used =  45.000
VGA256: Mode "800x600": mode clock =  40.000, clock used =  40.000
VGA256: Mode "496x372": mode clock =  25.000, clock used =  25.000
VGA256: Virtual resolution set to 1152x900
VGA256: SpeedUp code selection modified because virtualX != 1024
VGA256: SpeedUp mode selected (Flags=0xf)

waiting for X server to shut down 

xinit:  Interrupted system call (errno 4):  Client error.

--
Rich Skrenta <skrenta@summit.novell.com>

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
From: jfh@rpp386 (John F. Haugh II)
Subject: Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering")
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 03:34:15 GMT

In article <2linvj$7ue@fitz.TC.Cornell.EDU> elan@tasha.cheme.cornell.edu (Elan Feingold) writes:
>In contrast, getting a patch from a commercial compiler vendor is like getting
>teeth pulled, or something similar.  Even if they send you a patch, it takes
>a long time, and what about all the other users out there who have the buggy
>version?  They don't see that patch.

I don't know which companies you've been dealing with, but if you call
IBM and the bug is known, you can get a set of update floppies in your
hand in under 24 hours.

The problem with GCC and updates is that I don't have the slightest
idea where or how to get a new GCC.  I =do= know that the GCC I have
is broken.  I =do= know that the stock CC I have produces the correct
code each and ever time.  And I knew exactly where to go when it didn't.

Why should I waste my time searching for the latest patch (or hanging
out on the net, or hiring some support company, or ...) when I can
pick up the phone, dial customer suport and get a new compiler in less
than a day?
-- 
John F. Haugh II  [ NRA-ILA ] [ Kill Barney ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151 [GOP][DoF #17][PADI][ENTJ]   @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
 There are three documents that run my life: The King James Bible, the United
 States Constitution, and the UNIX System V Release 4 Programmer's Reference.

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: news.groups,comp.os.linux.announce,comp.os.linux.help,comp.os.linux.development,comp.os.linux.admin
From: rdippold@qualcomm.com (Ron "Asbestos" Dippold)
Subject: STRAW POLL: Linux groups automonitoring
Reply-To: voting@qualcomm.com (Ron Dippold Voting Alias)
Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 20:24:31 GMT

[]
                              STRAW POLL
                     Linux groups automonitoring

Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, Thu 17 March 1994.

This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party.  For voting
questions only contact rdippold@qualcomm.com.  For questions about the
proposal contact Ian Jackson <iwj@cam-orl.co.uk>.


 PROPOSAL (Ian)

 I propose to set up an auto-response daemon which will scan the
 newsgroups  comp.os.linux.misc, .help, .development and .admin.

 It will send email to the posters of any messages which either
  (a) do not include one of a set or recognised keywords in the
      Keywords line or
  (b) are crossposted between two or more of the groups listed above,
      without a Followup-To header being used to direct followups
      into no more than one of those groups (plus perhaps one or more
      groups outside the comp.os.linux hierarchy).

 The email will be a brief, friendly introduction to the newsgroup in
 question and the hierarchy in general - probably based on Matt Welsh's
 introduction to the comp.os.linux hierarchy and my daily postings in
 comp.os.linux.misc and .help.

 It will say where the FAQs are, why to read them, and where to get
 them.

 It will also say why the message has been sent to the user, and give a
 brief explanation of why Keywords are a good thing and/or why
 crossposting is a bad thing (as appropriate).

 I would determine the set of allowable keywords with assistance from
 the Linux community; I expect the set to change quite frequently, and
 there to be a dozen or two at most.

 The existence of my daemon would be documented in a regular posting to
 the groups (preferably as part of an existing regular posting).

 Note that this proposal will NOT prevent anyone from posting and does
 not involve marking the groups as moderated.                         
                                                                      
 I hope to be able to provide an email-to-news gateway that will be   
 allow users with retarded software to post with Keywords lines.      


 RATIONALE (Ian)

 During the recent discussion in news.groups regarding my original
 proposal to moderate col.* using a program, several people suggested
 that perhaps many of the "poor" posts do not come from first-time
 posters, and that therefore it would be sufficient to send email to
 posters whose postings did not have one of a set of approved keywords.

 Doing so would allow experienced users to start using killfiles to
 read only postings they believe they would find interesting, based on
 keywords, since any users posting without such keywords would be
 informed by the daemon that and why their posting might not get the
 attention they would wish for it.


HOW TO REPLY

Erase everything above the top "-=-=-=-" line and erase everything
below the bottom "-=-=-=-" line.  Do not erase anything between these
lines and do not change the group names.

Give your name on the line that asks for it. For each group, place a
YES or NO in the brackets next to it to vote for or against
automonitoring as described above for that particular group.  If
you don't want to vote on a particular group, just leave the space
blank.  Don't worry about spacing of the columns or any quote
characters (">") that your reply inserts.

Then mail the ballot to:    voting@qualcomm.com
Just Replying to this message should work, but check the "To:" line.

-=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
linux automoderation poll Ballot    <luxp-0001> (Don't remove this marker)

Give your real name here:

Use YES or NO for each group to indicate support or opposition to
automonitoring for that group as described in the proposal above.

[Your Vote]  Group
=======================================================================
[         ]  comp.os.linux.misc
[         ]  comp.os.linux.help
[         ]  comp.os.linux.admin
[         ]  comp.os.linux.development
-=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Anything else may be rejected by the automatic vote counting program.  The
votetaker will respond to your received ballots with a personal acknowledge-
ment by mail - if you do not receive one within several days, try again.
It's your responsibility to make sure your vote is registered correctly.

Only one ballot per person and per account will be counted.  All
names, addresses, and votes are public.


-- 
All generalizations are false.

------------------------------

From: bassman@isoit034.bbn.hp.com (Mr. Bassman)
Subject: Re: SoftPC/Linux?
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 08:11:59 GMT

In article <1994Mar9.214309.67781@yuma>, jmiller@terra.colostate.edu (Jeff Miller) writes:
|> Seeing how SoftPC runs reasonably well on Suns and Macintoshes, how hard
|> would it be for Insignia to make a PC emulator for the PC over Linux? I
|> think a product like this would bring Linux the compatibility it needs,
|> and the following it deserves.

        SoftPc (and SoftWindows) are software only solutions; it completely
emulates a 286.  What is more, you need at least 16Mb of free memory to run
it in, to get any decent sort of speed out of it.  We have it on our RISC
boxes here, and their claims of "low-end 486 speeds" can only be achieved
with a powerful machine with lots of memory and local swap (most here swap
over the net).  Put this on a linux box, and it may well work, but it would
be far too slow to use - think about it:  you take a x86 instruction and
emulate it, on an x86 processor.  This is silly, as you ought to runn the
instruction as-is on your processor, drastically reduing your overhead.  I'd
suggest a Dos-emu/Wine combination.  I understand the Dos-emu is doing very
well, but I'm not sure about Wine.  If that will run the word-processors and
similar stuff we use at work, then I may be in able to convince one of the
departmental bosses that using such a thing would be a good idea (as Soft
Windows is too slow, and we have mostly workstations round here).  {8-]
-- 
Mr. Bassman
Platform Services (UNIX)
Hewlett-Packard, Boeblingen, Germany
bassman@hpbbi30.bbn.hp.com

------------------------------

From: merlyn@winternet.mpls.mn.us (Doug McIntyre)
Subject: Re: Mosaic 2.2 problems
Date: 9 Mar 94 19:10:14 GMT

In <1994Mar9.101958.5306@swan.pyr> iiitac@swan.pyr (Alan Cox) writes:
>In article <CMD7Ku.E97@specialix.com> jonb@specialix.com (Jon Brawn) writes:
>>I have grabbed Mosaic 2.2 from somewhere (Sunsite probably), and I have the
>>following observations:
>>
>>1) I can't type into forms which are embedded in hypertext documents
>>  [I can paste into them from though]. I assume I haven't installed something
>>   somewhere...
>Snap.. Same problem: I've had this since Mosaic 2.0. I'm on the verge of
>giving up on the damn program and sticking to the other WWW browsers. Mosaic
>has gone from being large but smart to being large slow and buggy.

   This is a bug in Motif v1.2. It is fixed in at least v1.2.2 of Motif. 
I have compiled Mosiac v2.2 with Motif v1.2.2. It is available anonymous
FTP from icicle.winternet.mpls.mn.us in the ~ftp/pub/uploads/Mosaic
directory. Email me if you have any questions about it.
--
Doug McIntyre                           merlyn@icicle.winternet.mpls.mn.us

Write to info@winternet.mpls.mn.us for more information about Winternet's
Internet services and dialups. 

------------------------------

From: ron@draconia.hacktic.nl (Ron Smits)
Subject: Re: lost /lib/libc.so.4
Date: 8 Mar 1994 06:38:09 GMT

Dongjin Han (dj@lems25) wrote:


: --
: Hi Help me. I tried to symlink libc.so.4 to libc.4.5.19
: then I deleted libc.so.4 accidentely NO command are accepted!
: What shoud I do?
: Ahhhh.......
: Thanks ...

: , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
:  ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` `
: -Dongjin Han, , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
:  dj@lems.brown.edu ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` `  
: , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,
:  ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` ` `

--

run /etc/ldconfig it's static and repairs the links (among others)

                Ron Smits
                ron@draconia.hacktic.nl
                Ron.Smits@Netherlands.NCR.COM

/*-( My opinions are my opinions, My boss's opinions are his opinions )-*/
/*-(                They might not be the same                         -*/


------------------------------

From: bassman@isoit034.bbn.hp.com (Mr. Bassman)
Subject: Re: [grep] please replicate
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 10:17:03 GMT

In article <2lmg3a$jrf@crl.crl.com>, bhogan@crl.com (Bill Hogan) writes:
|>  I am running Slackware 1.1.1 and it appears the version of 'grep' I have 
|> does not work entirely correctly.
|> 
|>  Given the input file x:
|> 
|>      ddif
|>      dd if
|>      dd  if
|> 
|> the command
|> 
|>      grep dd\ *if x
|> 
|> correctly finds all three lines, but
|> 
|>      grep dd\ +if x
|> 
|> finds *none*, whereas I think it should find the *two* lines
|> 
|>      dd if
|>      dd  if
|> 
|> in the sense that
|> 
|>      grep dd\ \ *if
|> 
|> works as one would expect iff aa* and a+ mean the same thing.

        It seems you're confusing a regular expression with an extended regular
expression.  The grep command you used treats things like '+' as normal
characters.  You should use grep -E or egrep, and then you will get different
results.  The command:

        grep -E dd\ +if

returns the lines:

        dd if
        dd  if

whereas without the -E it returns nothing (as it can't find the + char in any
line).  Check out regexp(5).
-- 
Mr. Bassman
Platform Services (UNIX)
Hewlett-Packard, Boeblingen, Germany
bassman@hpbbi30.bbn.hp.com

------------------------------

From: tzs@u.washington.edu (Tim Smith)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
Subject: Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering")
Date: 10 Mar 1994 12:39:34 GMT

Elan Feingold <elan@tasha.cheme.cornell.edu> wrote:
>One of the nice things about gcc is that when a bug is found, it gets fixed
>pronto.  Users all over the country use gcc, abuse it, and some percentage of 
>then report the bugs they find, which then get fixed (eventually), and then
>new versions of gcc appear on prep.ai.mit.edu or where ever that include the
>fixes found.

If it's a politically correct bug, anyway...

--Tim Smith

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development
From: slouken@talbot.cs.ucdavis.edu (Whitstler)
Subject: I'm developing UMSDOS Linux Pkg.
Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 19:45:47 GMT


        I need some feedback from all you folks in the Linux
community.

        I'm impressed with the cabability of UMSDOS to run
Linux in the MSDOS filesystem, and intrigued by the possibility
of "drop-in" linux for the PC.

        The problem with most of the current distributions is
that they are too big and comprehensive for the "drop-in"
Linux concept.  There is also no current way to easily install
them onto the UMSDOS filesystem.

        What I'm working on is a package that will fill 
these gaps:

Version 1:      A generic mini-linux with full X and networking
                but fine tuned for the new shared libraries and
                kernel.  It won't have lots of obscure and
                duplicated binaries like SLS.  It will follow 
                the new Filesystem Standard, for the most part.
                I'm shooting for about a 50 Meg installation.

Version 2:      My own personal customized system; this one, based
                on Version 1.  It will have lots of cool stuff 
                installed, such as dosemu, ghostscript, customized
                X startup, gcc commpilers, full manpages,  etc.

Version 3:      A miniature drop-in Linux for anyone who wants
                to quickly convert an existing DOS system into 
                a fully networked, X workstation.  It will fit
                into 25 Megs, including swap and boot setup.


One of the advantages of this concept is that if you don't like
Linux when you set it up, it is trivial to remove it from your
DOS filesystem.  If you like it, it is just as trivial to install
more functionality and eat up your existing DOS installation.

        When I first installed the umsdos distribution,
I ran into problems with corrupt filesystems because of the
distributed init/shutdown procedure.  I switched to the new
System V init package (2.5) and that fixed those problems.
Since then I have not had chkdsk report any problems. (Even
after a crash)

        Hats off to the developers of UMSDOS!

My distribution would not be based on any current distributions,
and I'm hoping to have it available as a base installation in
pkzip files, and then tar files that will install similarly to
SLS.  By building it from scratch, I'll be able to avoid the
feeping creaturism that seems to be in some of the other
releases and adhere to the new standards that are coming out.
(No flames to other dists intended)  I'll also be able to 
strip some of the packages (such as groff) into the necessary
parts.  My philosophy is get rid of everything, see what breaks
and then put back the parts that are necessary.  I've gotten
full X and networking into 20 Megs.  In the process, I've learned
a heck of a lot about the way Linux systems are put together. :)


I have a couple of questions for you folks on the net.  

1.  What do you think about this idea?  Would you be willing to
    beta test it?  Are there any developers out there with some
    suggestions on the best way to put this together?

2.  How do I set up a LILO disk?  I'm trying to put a UMSDOS
    aware kernel onto a floppy containing a mini filesystem,
    similar to the way SLS does it.  Anybody know how to do
    that? 

3.  For the zip distribution, is there any dos archiver similar
    to tar?  Pkzip doesn't seem to have the functionality I 
    need to zip files and subdirectories from widely varying
    parts of a filesystem into a single zip file and then 
    unzip them into the proper places.  Would it be worth it
    to get GNU tar and gzip for dos and use that for the dist?

4.  On a different note, I noticed that when using pl15h, I 
    have no problems when mounting a UMSDOS filesystem as the
    root filesystem, but when I use pl15j, the system randomly
    crashes.  (EIP: 0010:00000000)  I've been hanging out with
    pl15h, but it would be nice to upgrade to the latest 
    kernel.

Well, thanks all you crazy Linuxers. :)

        -Sam



------------------------------


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