Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #794
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Thu, 10 Mar 94 12:13:23 EST

Linux-Misc Digest #794, Volume #1                Thu, 10 Mar 94 12:13:23 EST

Contents:
  Re: ex2fs / xiafs: File System Stability (Thomas G. McWilliams)
  Re: ncurses problem (Zeyd M. Ben-Halim)
  21" Radius Mono Monitor Supported? (Edward Baichtal)
  Re: SoftPC/Linux? (David J Camp)
  File System for Both (David J Camp)
  ups debugger (Thomas Esser)
  Re: Incense ??? what's it for? (Frank Lofaro)
  Re: DOOM for X (Frank Lofaro)
  driver needed for "AT-1500BT" by Allied Telesis (Jeff Murphy)
  Re: ups debugger
  Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering") (Stephane Boucher)
  Re: BSD vs. Linux (Alan Cox)
  Re: DOOM for X (Alan Cox)
  AX25 and Linux (cummings@stingray.speedway.net)
  *** PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (misc-2.07) (Ian Jackson)
  Re: DOOM for X (Philip Brown)
  Re: SoftPC/Linux? (Doug DeJulio)
  Re: "Reverse-engineering" (John Henders)
  Re: ex2fs / xiafs: File System Stability (Larry Doolittle)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: tgm@netcom.com (Thomas G. McWilliams)
Subject: Re: ex2fs / xiafs: File System Stability
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 12:16:04 GMT

Robert Sink (sinkr@universe.digex.net) wrote:
: Hello all - I was wondering if anyone could comment on the stability that 
: Linux offers running the ex2fs and/or the xiafs file systems?  Do they tend
: to operate well under pressure, etc?

In the strictest sense the xiafs is more stable. The code has been
essentially frozen for over a year with no ill effects. The ext2fs is
still under development.

: What is MOST likely to happen if say the system suffers a power-outage 
: while doing disk-intensive processing.

Most the time nothing too serious with either file system. But
there seems to be a problem with the ext2fs recovery tools.
Hardly a fortnight passes without some ext2fs tale of woe where
the recovery tools only have made matters worse. However, I
suspect that many times the ext2fs problems are due to operator
error or hardware problems and are not a direct reflection on
the safety of the ext2fs. 

: Any help/technical info would be GREATLY appreciated.

The xiafs was designed primarily to provide a stable, safe file
system by leveraging pre-existing debugged code. It provides the
basic most wanted features without complexity. The ext2fs has
been geared toward more features and expansibility. The ext2fs
is more complex and ambitious.

Thomas
tgm@netcom.com

------------------------------

From: zmbenhal@netcom.com (Zeyd M. Ben-Halim)
Subject: Re: ncurses problem
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 1994 19:16:14 GMT

In article <1994Mar7.231023.10980@kf8nh.wariat.org> bsa@kf8nh.wariat.org (Brandon S. Allbery) writes:
>| In article <2lfl3m$v8r@hermes.acs.ryerson.ca> bzarnett@jupiter.scs.Ryerson.CA (Bryan Zarnett) writes:
>| >In writing a program with ncurses it seems that when I activate noecho(),
>| >and keypad that it does not respond to the arrow and function keys, but when
>
>noecho() without cbreak()/crmode() is a pathological case for curses in
>general (the behavior varies between curses implementations; in particular,
>BSD and System V curses differ in its meaning, and ncurses may well differ
>from System V curses or from both).  If you're using noecho() without
>cbreak(), turn cbreak() on and see what effect it has.

SVR4 manuals, and ncurses', state that nocbreak() and echo() modes should
not be used at the same time. echo mode is the default, cbreak depends on
the terminal's state proir to the program. Programmers are expected to turn
echo off, cbreak on, or both at startup. Since he does noecho() things
should work ok. Without seeing the code in question it is hard to make any
judgement.

Zeyd

-- 
---
Zeyd M. Ben-Halim       zmbenhal@netcom.com
10479 1/4 Santa Monica Blvd, LA, CA, 90025 (310) 470-0281

------------------------------

From: edwardb@netcom.com (Edward Baichtal)
Subject: 21" Radius Mono Monitor Supported?
Date: 9 Mar 94 03:24:23 GMT

Unfortunately I don't have model numbers off hand, but I am wondering if
Linux supports the 21" Radius, which is a monochrome monitor?

It comes with it's own card, and I suppose it could be called SVGA.  I know
it does 1280x1024 in Windows.  If there is support for it I suppose it
would be in the Mono VGA libraries ... ? 

Please e-mail with any help at all.  I am desparate to get this monitor
working...
-- 
Edward Baichtal                         "Reality is an obstacle
edwardb@netcom.com                       to hallucination."

------------------------------

From: david@wubios.wustl.edu (David J Camp)
Subject: Re: SoftPC/Linux?
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 12:23:28 GMT

In article <1994Mar9.214309.67781@yuma> jmiller@terra.colostate.edu (Jeff Miller) writes:
>I was just thinking...
>
>Seeing how SoftPC runs reasonably well on Suns and Macintoshes, how hard
>would it be for Insignia to make a PC emulator for the PC over Linux? I
>think a product like this would bring Linux the compatibility it needs,
>and the following it deserves.
>
>I could then format my drive and make one big Linux partition :)

There is a product called "Locus Merge" that does this quite well.  I
am not certain if it has been ported to Linux.  -David-

>
>--
> ___________________________________________________________________________
>|                                                                           |
>| jmiller@terra.colostate.edu (Jeff Miller)  |  TERRA Systems Administrator |
>|___________________________________________________________________________|

# david@wubios.wustl.edu             David J. Camp BS MS     ^        #
# david@campfire.stl.mo.us           +1 314 382 0584       < * >      #
# I am a member of:  The League for Programming Freedom.     v        #
# abs (investment#1 - investment#2) << abs (anyinvestment - anydebt)  #

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.unix.bsd
From: david@wubios.wustl.edu (David J Camp)
Subject: File System for Both
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 12:27:29 GMT

Is there a filesystem that works under both Linux and BSD?  I would
like to develop both on the same system without deleting my code each
time.  -David-

# david@wubios.wustl.edu             David J. Camp BS MS     ^        #
# david@campfire.stl.mo.us           +1 314 382 0584       < * >      #
# I am a member of:  The League for Programming Freedom.     v        #
# abs (investment#1 - investment#2) << abs (anyinvestment - anydebt)  #


------------------------------

From: te@informatik.uni-hannover.de (Thomas Esser)
Subject: ups debugger
Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 20:30:04 GMT

Hi,

does anybody have a working version of the ups debugger? The thing
I have dumps core when I want to inspect a variable.

A binary would be nice, sources better, diffs from ups-2.45.2.tar best.

Many thanks in advance.

--
Thomas Esser                       email: te@informatik.uni-hannover.de
Universitaet Hannover, Institut fuer Informatik  (Systemadministration)

------------------------------

From: ftlofaro@unlv.edu (Frank Lofaro)
Subject: Re: Incense ??? what's it for?
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 94 00:34:55 GMT

In article <2lkfk7$5la@acorn.acorn.co.uk> wturner@acorn.co.uk (William Turner) writes:
>In article <spears.762803409@sfu.ca> spears@kits.sfu.ca (Matthew Spears) writes:
>
>>dpk5m@galen.med.Virginia.EDU (Daniel P. Key) writes:
>>
>>>I'm am unable to find much information on the *use of incense
>>>to enhance meditation*.
>>
>>>Some folks are saying, now, that it's toxic...Doesn't seem that
>>>something could have lasted so long without being helpful. My
>>>question... what's incense really for....what does it do ?
>>>...and are there any good *sources of information* ?
>>
>>   If it helps you relax, it's certainly helpful.
>> 
>>   Sri Chinmoy mentioned it in one of his many books.  He said that
>>spirit beings find it hard to be near us and talk 
>
>What is this doing in the Linux newsgroup?
>
>Has it been crossposted from another group because they can hear
>the stressfull screams eminating from the readers of this newsgroup
>when their attempt to compile the kernel fails for the n'th time?
>
>William
>
>PS: How do you correctly pronounce 'X'? :-)
>
>-----------------
>Any opinions in the above passage are obviously the result of corruption
>during transmission of this article 

        I know why they need meditation and incense, and it *DOES*
relate to Linux. They need something so they can recover from the
extreme stress and frustration of dealing with Linux networking!

1/2 :)


------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.apps
From: ftlofaro@unlv.edu (Frank Lofaro)
Subject: Re: DOOM for X
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 94 00:39:36 GMT

In article <2lka68$7h8@darkstar.UCSC.EDU> philb@cats.ucsc.edu (Philip Brown) writes:
>
>(although speaking of hacks, I trust the unix version will be a LOT nicer
>to networks... I still haven't played DOOM yet.. I don't dare too, cause
>I believe I'll crash our PC network?! :-> )
>

And networking under Linux is safe?!

1/2 :)


------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help,sunyab.free-unix
From: jcmurphy@acsu.buffalo.edu (Jeff Murphy)
Subject: driver needed for "AT-1500BT" by Allied Telesis
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 1994 19:29:56 GMT


        subject says it all! i am looking for source code to a driver for
        the at-1500bt ethernet card by allied telesis. i called the company
        and was told that there is one available for linux.. now all i have
        to do is find it!

        anyone have any hints???


        thanks!!!


        Jeff m.
-- 
jcmurphy@acsu.buffalo.edu                            ece/cs             cit oss
opnsmurf@ubvms.bitnet                                standard disclaimers apply
''She walks in beauty, like the night - Of cloudless climes and starry skies.''

------------------------------

From:  ()
Subject: Re: ups debugger
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 09:59:30 GMT

In article <1994Mar9.203004.16523@newsserver.rrzn.uni-hannover.de>,
te@informatik.uni-hannover.de (Thomas Esser) wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> does anybody have a working version of the ups debugger? The thing
> I have dumps core when I want to inspect a variable.
> 
> A binary would be nice, sources better, diffs from ups-2.45.2.tar best.
> 
> Many thanks in advance.
> 
> --
> Thomas Esser                       email: te@informatik.uni-hannover.de
> Universitaet Hannover, Institut fuer Informatik  (Systemadministration)

Pip-pip

  I too would be most interested in getting a working version of the ups
debugger.  It is a darling debugger to use, and I am missing it terribly. 
I encounter the same problem as described above.


...Lowel.

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
From: sbo@bcars656.bnr.ca (Stephane Boucher)
Subject: Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering")
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 14:45:54 GMT

>>>>> "John" == John F Haugh <jfh@rpp386> writes:
In article <1994Mar10.033415.10872@rpp386> jfh@rpp386 (John F. Haugh II) writes:

John> In article <2linvj$7ue@fitz.TC.Cornell.EDU>
John> elan@tasha.cheme.cornell.edu (Elan Feingold) writes:
>> In contrast, getting a patch from a commercial compiler vendor is
>> like getting teeth pulled, or something similar.  Even if they send
>> you a patch, it takes a long time, and what about all the other users
>> out there who have the buggy version?  They don't see that patch.

John> I don't know which companies you've been dealing with, but if you
John> call IBM and the bug is known, you can get a set of update
John> floppies in your hand in under 24 hours.

What if the bug is not known ?

John> The problem with GCC and updates is that I don't have the
John> slightest idea where or how to get a new GCC.  I =do= know that
John> the GCC I have is broken.  I =do= know that the stock CC I have
John> produces the correct code each and ever time.  And I knew exactly
John> where to go when it didn't.

No. You won't get a number in the phone book for GCC support :-) But
with little effort you should be able to get one. One question you could
ask to the net is: "Where can I get commercial support for GCC?". Try it
and see what answers you'll get.

John> Why should I waste my time searching for the latest patch (or
John> hanging out on the net, or hiring some support company, or ...)
John> when I can pick up the phone, dial customer suport and get a new
John> compiler in less than a day?

Hein??? We do just that with GCC. Dial customer support, and get patches
in no time. Hell, they even came on site on a few occasions... admitedly
though, we're a big customer
--
  ,
Stephane Boucher       Recherche Bell-Northern Research
sbo@bnr.ca
[Mes opinions sont les miennes -- My opinions are mine]

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.unix.bsd
From: iiitac@swan.pyr (Alan Cox)
Subject: Re: BSD vs. Linux
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 12:06:46 GMT

In article <ARNEJ.94Mar9134803@supernova.pvv.unit.no> arnej@pvv.unit.no (Arne H. Juul) writes:
>
>            BSD                Linux
>Shell       ash, csh           bash, tcsh
>C library   BSD                Homebrew GNU libc ???
>vi          nvi                elvis
>Compiler    GCC (modified)     GCC
>Linker      GNU ld (w/mods)    GNU ld (w/even more mods)
>X           Xfree86            Xfree86
>Utilities   BSD                GNU

Ah obviously the NetBSD I played with recently had been upgraded to real
tools.
>
>Running Linux for its networking code seems somewhat odd to me.

I need IPX networking, AX.25 amateur radio sockets and the ability to
run NETX in a dos box on my Unix system. Linux networking is more powerful
but less stable in some areas. Anyway you have a 15 year advantage.. and
compatibility by default.

Alan
iiitac@pyr.swan.ac.uk



------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.apps
From: iiitac@swan.pyr (Alan Cox)
Subject: Re: DOOM for X
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 12:30:47 GMT

In article <hastyCMEw58.FMr@netcom.com> hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr) writes:
>I really doubt that a direct access to a fast svga card on a local bus would
>compare in performance to the client-server model of X.
I thought the same, but time it one day. XShm is incredibly quick, you
just tell the x server do this shm object and carry on. On something like a 
6 cpu sparc its even better as X is rendering your image while you work
on the next one
>
>If you ask me X is very, very broken in this respect. 
Apparently not.

Alan

------------------------------

From: cummings@stingray.speedway.net
Subject: AX25 and Linux
Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 04:29:21 GMT


Just curious, I got the ALPHA 1.0 kernel up and running, tried the ax25 bit
and noticed a problem.  My callsign (N0HDW) does not go out.  The only thing
I see from the other end is my IP address.  I used the commands
axattach /dev/ttyS0 n0hdw
route thingie...
axaddarp 44.46.81.1 n0hdw

to set this up.  It works, just no legal ID.

I also had this problem under pl15h, so it's nothing that just happened. 
Any hints or areas to check would be appreciated.

BTW, does anyone know if the crond daemon is broken under ALPHA 1.0?  When I
boot, everything gets run at once, it's a BIG load on my system, then it
works normally thereafter.  Worked fine under pl14.
-- 
Internet: cummings@stingray.speedway.net

------------------------------

From: ijackson@nyx.cs.du.edu (Ian Jackson)
Subject: *** PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (misc-2.07)
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 11:03:01 GMT

Please do not post questions to comp.os.linux.misc - read on for details of
which groups you should read and post to.

Please do not crosspost anything between different groups of the comp.os.linux
hierarchy.  See Matt Welsh's introduction to the hierarchy, posted weekly.

If you have a question about Linux you should get and read the Linux Frequently
Asked Questions with Answers list from sunsite.unc.edu, in /pub/Linux/docs, or
from another Linux FTP site.  It is also posted periodically to c.o.l.announce.

In particular, read the question `You still haven't answered my question!'
The FAQ will refer you to the Linux HOWTOs (more detailed descriptions of
particular topics) found in the HOWTO directory in the same place.

Then you should consider posting to comp.os.linux.help - not
comp.os.linux.misc.

Note that X Windows related questions should go to comp.windows.x.i386unix, and
that non-Linux-specific Unix questions should go to comp.unix.questions.
Please read the FAQs for these groups before posting - look on rtfm.mit.edu in
/pub/usenet/news.answers/Intel-Unix-X-faq and .../unix-faq.

Only if you have a posting that is not more appropriate for one of the other
Linux groups - ie it is not a question, not about the future development of
Linux, not an announcement or bug report and not about system administration -
should you post to comp.os.linux.misc.


Comments on this posting are welcomed - please email me !
--
Ian Jackson  <ijackson@nyx.cs.du.edu>  (urgent email: iwj10@phx.cam.ac.uk)
2 Lexington Close, Cambridge, CB4 3LS, England;  phone: +44 223 64238

------------------------------

From: philb@cats.ucsc.edu (Philip Brown)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.apps
Subject: Re: DOOM for X
Date: 10 Mar 1994 01:09:28 GMT


In <hastyCMEw58.FMr@netcom.com> hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr) writes:

>In article <2lkpg5$8hn@Tut.MsState.Edu> simmons@EE.MsState.Edu writes:
>>
>>The X version should be just as fast as an svgalib version, because
>>David Taylor is using the shared memory extentions of X.  Hence,
>>no real need for an svga version.
>>

>I really doubt that a direct access to a fast svga card on a local bus would
>compare in performance to the client-server model of X.
>If you ask me X is very, very broken in this respect. 

X is just fine in this respect. That's what makes it a portable windowing
system, not "Yet Another Extension to DOS".
Quit the harshing on X until you see what can actually be done with it.
Methinks it sounds like DOOM will be done fairly soon.
["soon" being in two months or so?]

-- 
 ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Philip Brown, CIS major, UC Santa Cruz
Author of "kdrill", and "xmandel"
Winging my way out of academia soon...
philb@cats.ucsc.edu philb@soda.berkeley.edu

------------------------------

From: ddj+@cs.cmu.edu (Doug DeJulio)
Subject: Re: SoftPC/Linux?
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 1994 14:49:57 GMT

In article <CMFw40.E1G@hpwin052.uksr.hp.com>,
Mr. Bassman <bassman@isoit034.bbn.hp.com> wrote:
>In article <1994Mar9.214309.67781@yuma>, jmiller@terra.colostate.edu (Jeff Miller) writes:
>|> Seeing how SoftPC runs reasonably well on Suns and Macintoshes, how hard
>|> would it be for Insignia to make a PC emulator for the PC over Linux? I
>|> think a product like this would bring Linux the compatibility it needs,
>|> and the following it deserves.
>
>       SoftPc (and SoftWindows) are software only solutions; it completely
>emulates a 286.

This is true for the versions that run on non-intel CPUs.  The version
of SoftPC for NeXTStep for Intel processors does indeed use the CPU to
execute 8086 instructions, I'm told.

-- 
Doug DeJulio
ddj+@cmu.edu

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
From: jhenders@jonh.wimsey.com (John Henders)
Subject: Re: "Reverse-engineering"
Date: Wed, 9 Mar 1994 22:27:45 GMT

rasmith@comp..uark.edu (Richard Smith) writes:

>If someone would care to point out an X based editor ( or Xterm) that they
> really like, I would be most happy to hear from them.  I really would like
>to find a system that will allow me the write/compile/debug capabilities that
>I have under the Borland 3.1 EDITOR.

        There's a great on called xwpe that is a clone of the Borland IDE,
including debugging. Unfortunately, the docs are all in German, though all
the menus are in English.

-- 
           John Henders - Wimsey Information Services
           GAT/MU/AE d- -p+(--) c++++ l++ u++ t- m--- 
               e* s-/+ n-(?) h++ f+ g+ w+++ y*

------------------------------

From: doolitt@cebaf4.cebaf.gov (Larry Doolittle)
Subject: Re: ex2fs / xiafs: File System Stability
Reply-To: doolitt@cebaf4.cebaf.gov (Larry Doolittle)
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 1994 13:55:38 GMT

In article <sinkr.763119612@universe>, sinkr@universe.digex.net (Robert
Sink) writes:
> Hello all - I was wondering if anyone could comment on the stability that 
> Linux offers running the ex2fs and/or the xiafs file systems?  Do they tend
> to operate well under pressure, etc?
> 
> What is MOST likely to happen if say the system suffers a power-outage 
> while doing disk-intensive processing.
> 
> Any help/technical info would be GREATLY appreciated.

You can expect to go down in flames, no matter your choice of filesystems.

Seriously, there are two things you can to to avoid problems:
1. (preferred)  Buy a UPS.  Decent ones are US$200, very cheap insurance.
2. (secondrate) Localize problems by using multiple partitions.
I do both, and have never had a serious problem with ext2fs.

             - Larry Doolittle   doolittle@cebaf.gov

------------------------------


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