Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #805
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Sun, 13 Mar 94 09:13:06 EST

Linux-Misc Digest #805, Volume #1                Sun, 13 Mar 94 09:13:06 EST

Contents:
  Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering") (Clint Olsen)
  Re: *** DON'T READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (Wolfgang Schelongowski)
  Linux on IBM PS/2 70 (Carl Hoang)
  Re: 486SX vs 486DX - difference in performance using Linux (Martien Hulsen)
  *** PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (misc-2.07) (Ian Jackson)
  Re: Installing xdm & xdm wouldn't let anyone in (Sergey I Panov)
  Re: Info on chosing PC UNIX(summary) (David Yack)
  Re: "Reverse-engineering" (Russell Nelson)
  Re: Sparc vs. 486/Pentium [WAS:Re: Mail Order Linux Workstation Vendors] (David Marples)
  Re: BSD vs. Linux (Nate Williams)
  Re: Network support changes? (Ron Smits)
  Re: broken crond ? (cummings@stingray.speedway.net)
  Re: PCI motherboard and devices (Zenon Fortuna)
  Linux users in NYC area? (Tim Martin)
  segment error (Richard Pritz)
  wanted: printer filter (Mark Fernyhough)
  xconsole doesn't work (Mark Fernyhough)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: olsenc@maxwell.ee.washington.edu (Clint Olsen)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
Subject: Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering")
Date: 12 Mar 1994 23:11:06 GMT

In article <2lqfgo$1a4@pdq.coe.montana.edu>,
Nate Williams <nate@bsd.coe.montana.edu> wrote:
>In article <2linvj$7ue@fitz.tc.cornell.edu>,
>Elan Feingold <elan@tasha.cheme.cornell.edu> wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry to be so long-winded, but I get the impression that some people
>>> think these products are just tossed out the door when it suits someone's
>>> whim. 
>>
>>One of the nice things about gcc is that when a bug is found, it gets fixed
>>pronto.
>
>You haven't had much experience with reporting bugs and having them
>fixed in GCC, have you?  There are still bugs that exist that existed
>from gcc2.4 in gcc2.5.  They may be difficult to fix, or they may be
>'less important' to folks to fix, but there are none-the-less bugs that
>aren't fixed.

It has been stated over and over that if you see a bug that's been
hanging around for a few releases that you should mail gnu@prep.ai.mit.edu
(or something like that).

Don't bitch, file a report.

-Clint
--
Clint Olsen
University of Washington
Electrical Engineering
olsenc@maxwell.ee.washington.edu

------------------------------

From: ws@xivic.bo.open.de (Wolfgang Schelongowski)
Subject: Re: *** DON'T READ THIS BEFORE POSTING ***
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 94 21:31:23 MET

bhogan@crl.com (Bill Hogan) writes:

>   If you have a question, just ask it!

DON'T. comp.os.linux.* is flooded enough.

>   (A great scientist was once asked if he had found the answer. "Answers
> are relatively easy", said the Professor, "finding the right question,
> that's the hard part.")

That's why you should sit back, think, RTFM etc., get local help ...
before posting. Then you will either have solved your problem or found
the right question. Wasting bandwidth and time of _other_ people without
efforts on your own is not only rude, it will make these newsgroups
write-only (i.e. dead) newsgroups.

--
Wolfgang Schelongowski  ws@xivic.bo.open.de

"Don't try the paranormal until you know what's normal."
  -- Terry Pratchett, Lords and Ladies

------------------------------

From: Carl.Hoang@f31.n282.z1.tdkt.mn.org (Carl Hoang)
Subject: Linux on IBM PS/2 70
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 1994 08:00:02 -0600

Is there a Linux OS that will work on an IBM PS/2 Model 70 
with MCA bus?  I have the SLS version from tsx-11.mit.edu 
FTP site and it just doesn't like the MCA bus at all? 
Thanks. 
   Carl Hoang   carl.hoang@tdkt.mn.org 
 
 
... OFFLINE 1.41 

 * Origin: Dark Knight's Table (1:282/31)

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.sys.intel
From: martien@dutw85.wbmt.tudelft.nl (Martien Hulsen)
Subject: Re: 486SX vs 486DX - difference in performance using Linux
Date: Sun, 13 Mar 1994 10:14:06 GMT

Ove Hansen (ove@groovy.neu.sgi.com) wrote:
> I'm aware of the difference between the various CPUs but what I would 
> like to know is how important the FPU in the DX processor is for the
> performance of a system running Linux (or Unix in general). What will 
> the performance hit be if I choose an SX over a DX processor (assuming 
> both have the same processor speed)? Of course this would depend upon 
> what I do (I assume posting this would take the same amount of time 
> on both :-) but let's assume the system has oodles of memory and would 
> be used for:

> - X-windows (using the usual desktop tools, and Tseng ET4000 or Trident 
>   TVGA display adapter)

Two comments:

   - I think the only situation you may consider saving money
     by buying a 486sx instead of a 486DX is when you use your Linux box
     only for the X-server (like an X-terminal) and run your X-programs 
     on a remote machine (with a FPU). In all other cases: buy a 486DX.
     To give an example: the screen build-up of xfig (a drawing program)
     is slow when run an a 486sx, but fast on a 486DX or when it
     runs on a remote machine.

   - Do not save the few $ by choosing Tseng or Trident: buy a $150 S3-card.
     You will not regret it. Most annoying about tseng and trident is slow
     text scrolling in a window. Some results from my own xbench runs
     (on a 486sx/25Mhz :-):

     Trident 8900CL:
          rate =     3.21 scrolls/sec (821894 Pixels/sec)
     Tseng ET4000:
          rate =    12.62 scrolls/sec (3230896 Pixels/sec)
     S3-801:
          rate =    88.71 scrolls/sec (22710857 Pixels/sec)
     
     Says it all.

Martien Hulsen
hulsen@wbmt.tudelft.nl

> - compiling/developing source
> - News (INN) and mail server

> how much of a gain is the DX in the different situations? 

> -- 
> Ove Hansen - e-mail: ove@groovy.neu.sgi.com

------------------------------

From: ijackson@nyx.cs.du.edu (Ian Jackson)
Subject: *** PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (misc-2.07)
Date: Sun, 13 Mar 1994 11:03:01 GMT

Please do not post questions to comp.os.linux.misc - read on for details of
which groups you should read and post to.

Please do not crosspost anything between different groups of the comp.os.linux
hierarchy.  See Matt Welsh's introduction to the hierarchy, posted weekly.

If you have a question about Linux you should get and read the Linux Frequently
Asked Questions with Answers list from sunsite.unc.edu, in /pub/Linux/docs, or
from another Linux FTP site.  It is also posted periodically to c.o.l.announce.

In particular, read the question `You still haven't answered my question!'
The FAQ will refer you to the Linux HOWTOs (more detailed descriptions of
particular topics) found in the HOWTO directory in the same place.

Then you should consider posting to comp.os.linux.help - not
comp.os.linux.misc.

Note that X Windows related questions should go to comp.windows.x.i386unix, and
that non-Linux-specific Unix questions should go to comp.unix.questions.
Please read the FAQs for these groups before posting - look on rtfm.mit.edu in
/pub/usenet/news.answers/Intel-Unix-X-faq and .../unix-faq.

Only if you have a posting that is not more appropriate for one of the other
Linux groups - ie it is not a question, not about the future development of
Linux, not an announcement or bug report and not about system administration -
should you post to comp.os.linux.misc.


Comments on this posting are welcomed - please email me !
--
Ian Jackson  <ijackson@nyx.cs.du.edu>  (urgent email: iwj10@phx.cam.ac.uk)
2 Lexington Close, Cambridge, CB4 3LS, England;  phone: +44 223 64238

------------------------------

From: sipan@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Sergey I Panov)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help,comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Re: Installing xdm & xdm wouldn't let anyone in
Date: 13 Mar 1994 06:47:47 GMT

From: ron@draconia.hacktic.nl (Ron Smits)

Johannes Rest (rest@rrz.Uni-Koeln.DE) wrote:
: ...
: the subject line says it. I've installed xdm, but how do i get it running?
: Which files must be altered? Please respond!
: ...
Ron Smits (ron@draconia.hacktic.nl) replyed:

>In my /etc/inittab I have this line:
>x1:6:wait:/etc/rc.x11
>so If I do a telinit 6, this line is executed. The contents of rc.x11 is:
>--snip snip--
>:
>#! /bin/sh
>#
># rc.6         This file is executed by init(8) when the system is being
>#              initialized for run level 6 (which usually means X Windows
>#              on LINUX/Pro).
>#
># Version:     @(#)/etc/rc.d/rc.6      2.00    02/17/93
>#
># Author:      Fred N. van Kempen, <waltje@uwalt.nl.mugnet.org>
>#
>
># Tell the viewers what's going to happen...
>if [ -x /usr/X386/bin/xdm ];then
>       echo "Starting up X Windows V.11 R.5..."
>       exec /usr/X386/bin/xdm -nodaemon
>else echo "/usr/bin/X386/bin/xdm is missing";fi
>
>--snip snip--

I tryed this instead of simply putting xdm at thr end of my rc.local
as well as plain inittab change ():

> [...]
> # BEWARE: where is your getty? in /bin or in /etc? possibly going
> # single user.
> c1:123456:respawn:/etc/getty 9600 tty1
> c2:23456:respawn:/etc/getty 9600 tty2
> c3:3456:respawn:/etc/getty 9600 tty3
> c4:456:respawn:/etc/getty 9600 tty4
> #c6:456:respawn:/etc/getty 9600 tty6
> c6:456:wait:/usr/X386/bin/xdm
> #
> [...]

As before I am getting: Login incorrect
Can someone with xdm succsess story send me a list of processes that he
have running from startup?
What type of passwords are on your machine - shadow or normall (to be honest I 
do not know what the differenece ).I am not 100% sure but I believe that I have
normal passwords (Slackware 1.1.1?)

All the best
Sergey

                Ron Smits
                ron@draconia.hacktic.nl
                Ron.Smits@Netherlands.NCR.COM

/*-( My opinions are my opinions, My boss's opinions are his opinions )-*/
/*-(                They might not be the same                         -*/




------------------------------

From: dyack@kaiwan.com (David Yack)
Crossposted-To: comp.unix.sysv386,comp.unix.pc-clone.32bit
Subject: Re: Info on chosing PC UNIX(summary)
Date: 12 Mar 1994 22:45:58 -0800

I would like to get a copy of your summary. dyack@kaiwan.com
Thanks


Estella Pok (pok@tiger.vill.edu) wrote:
: Hi Net:
:       I posted a question on searching PC Unix early and I received kindly
: help from many folks on the net. I appreciated those people who helped
: and would like to share the info I got with the net. Any one who is
: interested in getting some infomation on chosing PC UNIX can drop me
: an email, I'll happy to send it to you. By the way, Tom Svaleklev
: (tsva@ineab.ikea.sa?), I couldn't send the info you wanted becuase my
: mail system complained about your address.

: Estella Pok

: Internet: pok@tiger.vill.edu or pok@monet.vill.edu

------------------------------

From: nelson@crynwr.crynwr.com (Russell Nelson)
Subject: Re: "Reverse-engineering"
Date: 11 Mar 1994 15:45:39 GMT

In article <1994Mar10.032232.10771@rpp386> jfh@rpp386 (John F. Haugh II) writes:

   GNUware survives for exactly one reason -- people with precious little
   to do with their time churn out version after version of software.  And
   while many of those versions have neato keen features, in many cases
   those versions build on the incompatibilities of the versions before
   them.  Without market forces to keep the development cycle from
   careening wildly out of control, GNUware continues to pump out crud
   like EMACS -- the only editor likely to show up in /usr/include/errno.h
   as a return code from the OS for "Editor Too Big".

M-k C-c C-k C-a is the best response to jfh.

--
-russ <nelson@crynwr.com>      ftp.msen.com:pub/vendor/crynwr/crynwr.wav
Crynwr Software   | Crynwr Software sells packet driver support | ask4 PGP key
11 Grant St.      | +1 315 268 1925 (9201 FAX)    | Quakers do it in the light
Potsdam, NY 13676 | LPF member - ask me about the harm software patents do.

------------------------------

From: dmarples@voyager.eee.strath.ac.uk (David Marples)
Crossposted-To: comp.unix.pc-clone.32bit
Subject: Re: Sparc vs. 486/Pentium [WAS:Re: Mail Order Linux Workstation Vendors]
Date: 13 Mar 94 12:22:31

We've got a fair few Sparcs of varying dimensions around here, the
fastest being LX's.  Linux on a 486DX2/66 PCI certainly *feels*
faster, especially with an accel. video card under X.  Seeing as most
of my work is interactive (i.e. editing etc) this is more important to
me than raw horsepower.  As with you guys I've not done any real formal
comparisons 'cos that sounds like work.....

Oh yeah, LX's are about 7000UKP, a fully loaded 486DX2/66 PCI is about
3000UKP.

DAVE

------------------------------

From: nate@bsd.coe.montana.edu (Nate Williams)
Crossposted-To: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: BSD vs. Linux
Date: 11 Mar 1994 18:36:07 GMT

In article <DHOLLAND.94Mar10205415@husc7.harvard.edu>,
David Holland <dholland@husc7.harvard.edu> wrote:
>
>iiitac@swan.pyr's message of Thu, 10 Mar 1994 12:06:46 GMT said:
>
> > Linux networking is more powerful but less stable in some areas.
> > Anyway you [*BSD] have a 15 year advantage.. and compatibility by
> > default.
>
>Don't forget that a 15 year advantage also means 15 years of
>accumulated cruft.

*WRONG*

>NetBSD (and the other 386 BSDs) require more system
>than Linux does.

*WRONG*

With the current shlib implementation, the system requirements for
FreeBSD are the same or less as those of Linux.  However, the
installation process for Linux is such that it's easier to install
'pieces and parts' of the system as separate units rather than the
'whole shooting match' that the FreeBSD install does.  This will be
dealt with in the future, but at this point in time it's not possible
to install FreeBSD with as little disk space as Linux.  

However, don't confuse install problems with system requirements.


Nate
-- 
nate@bsd.coe.montana.edu     |  FreeBSD core member and all around tech.
nate@cs.montana.edu          |  weenie.
work #: (406) 994-4836       |  Graduating May '94 with a BS in EE 
home #: (406) 586-0579       |  - looking for work in CS/EE field.

------------------------------

From: ron@draconia.hacktic.nl (Ron Smits)
Subject: Re: Network support changes?
Date: 12 Mar 1994 10:40:58 GMT

Deryk Barker (dbarker@turing.camosun.bc.ca) wrote:

: Somewhere between pl12 (which I am running now) and pl15 something
: seems to have changed with regard to ethernet support.

: I loaded the pl15(g?) kernel, compiled it and booted from floppy.
: Everything was fine until rc.net, when I got a 'network unreachable
: error'. By everything I include my ethercard's being correctly
: identified, IRQ and port address just as before.

: I posted in comp.linux.help and got mail from several poeople saying
: they had the same problem and could I let them know what I found. So
: far I have heard nothing else, except a suggestion to get the latest
: pl15 or the pre-1.0.

: So I got the pre-1.0 and guess what - same problem.

: Some of my students tried to upgrade from pl12 to pl14 and had similar
: problems. So - has anything in ifconfig or somewhere similar been
: changed? Anybody any ideas?

: --
: Deryk.
: =================================================================
: |Deryk Barker, Computer Science Dept.         | Without music, life   |
: |Camosun College, Victoria, BC, Canada        | would be a mistake    |
: |email: dbarker@camosun.bc.ca           |                     |
: |phone: +1 604 370 4452                       | (Friedrich Nietzsche).|
: =================================================================

--

Between pl12 and pre-1.0, the networking material has undergone some heavy
changes. I suggest you get the net-032 package and install it.
It solved the problems for me after some midnight sessions

                Ron Smits
                ron@draconia.hacktic.nl
                Ron.Smits@Netherlands.NCR.COM

/*-( My opinions are my opinions, My boss's opinions are his opinions )-*/
/*-(                They might not be the same                         -*/


------------------------------

From: cummings@stingray.speedway.net
Subject: Re: broken crond ?
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 1994 18:25:03 GMT

James Morris (jmorris@mu.apana.org.au) wrote:
: The crond program on my system is acting strangely..

: When I boot Linux, it sets off all of the crontabs - even
: ones that are not due to be executed at the time.

: The base system is Slackware 1.1.1 (Linux pl.14).

Same base system here.

Yes, I have the same, though it worked fine until I put up ALPHA 1.0, then
it does what yours is doing.  Kinda bogs the machine down.  I would love to
see some advice here, I plan to get the source to crond and recompile and
see if it helps, will post results if it works.
-- 
Internet: cummings@stingray.speedway.net

------------------------------

From: zenon@resonex.com (Zenon Fortuna)
Subject: Re: PCI motherboard and devices
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 1994 22:22:54 GMT

In article <CMDI1r.E6y@mcc.com> msingh@weber.mcc.com (Munindar Singh) writes:
>Hi,
>
>Has anyone successfully run Linux on a PCI bus system, i.e., with a
>PCI motherboard?
>
>The Linux_INFO-SHEET (last updated 21 Jan) says that "Some people have
>started support for PCI, but it is currently not ready for the
>standard distribution on Linux."  Since apparently releases are made
>quite frequently, has there been any change in this status?  

I have installed the SLS 1.03 (but I will reinstall to Slackware) on a
P5-66 system. Only the graphics card was a PCI one - the SCSI disk interface
(and some other, not realated to installation, devices) were IDE.
Linux used the devices without problem.

>Do people have a feel for how long it might take before Linux becomes
>usable on PCI bus systems (not fully debugged, just usable)?  Is
>special complexity to be expected if, say, IDE devices are used on a
>PCI bus?

I am waiting impatiently for support of the NCR PCI-SC200 FAST SCSI card ...
It was a discussion about relevant driver almost 2 months ago, but since
then a big silence.

>[...]
>I welcome comments, even if they are speculative in nature.
>
>Thanks a lot,
>Munindar Singh (new to Linux)
>msingh@mcc.com      


        zenon@resonex.com

------------------------------

From: martin@ulysses.sis.ualberta.ca (Tim Martin)
Subject: Linux users in NYC area?
Date: 10 Mar 94 17:04:39 GMT

A colleague in New York City wants to install Linux on his
computer.  He doesn't have full Internet access, and only
limited email access, so FTP or mail servers aren't an 
option.  Are there any Linux users/gurus/geeks/techies
in the NYC area who might help him out, by loaning a
set of disks, or a CD or tape or some such, of (relatively)
up-to-date installation stuff?  Or do you know of a good
supplier in NYC?

If so, please send Email to Jon David:
  david@dockmaster.ncsc.mil

Don't respond here: he doesn't read this newsgroup, and I'm
gone for a week or so.

Tim.

 -----------------------------------------------------------------
  Tim Martin                       *      Reluctant to find he's 
  Spatial Information Systems      *      stuck in the nineties
  University of Alberta            *      again.
  martin@ulysses.sis.ualberta.ca   *              - Moxy Fruvous
 ------------------------------------------------------------------


------------------------------

From: rpritz@phantom.com (Richard Pritz)
Subject: segment error
Date: 13 Mar 1994 13:43:01 GMT


running linux, i frequently get the following errors (i) i get dropped
back to the login prompt.  sometimes this happens at login, so i login,
it says hello, then asks me to login again, (i) illegal instruction
error, (iii) segmentation fault, (iv) general protection 0000.  the last
is followed by register info and errors such as swapper errors, kernal
panics, etc.

i'm using slackware 1.1.2, which installed absolutely clean, and just the
base (idekern) and ap's packages.

i have a gateway 2000 two year old 486/33, 12 mb, a wd 340 (linux is
90mb, swap part is 10mb), a diamond speedstar plus (old et4000 video
card),  a 14.4 modem, plus mouse monitor and keyboard. any ideas?



------------------------------

From: ferny@pc64.maths.bris.ac.uk (Mark Fernyhough)
Subject: wanted: printer filter
Date: Sun, 13 Mar 1994 13:57:05 GMT

[ Article crossposted from comp.os.linux.help ]
[ Author was Mark Fernyhough ]
[ Posted on Sat, 12 Mar 1994 19:14:00 GMT ]

Does anyone out there know if i could get hold of a filter which strips out
control characters and alike from ascii files. The main reason for this
is when i try and print man pages( man *** | lpr) on my machine i get stuff 
like:-  N NA AM ME E instead of NAME etc. I have tried to convert to 
postscript but still can't get rid of control characters.

Thanks in advance

Mark

------------------------------

From: ferny@pc64.maths.bris.ac.uk (Mark Fernyhough)
Subject: xconsole doesn't work
Date: Sun, 13 Mar 1994 13:57:15 GMT

[ Article crossposted from comp.os.linux.help ]
[ Author was Mark Fernyhough ]
[ Posted on Sat, 12 Mar 1994 17:18:09 GMT ]

I can't get xconsole to work at all. All the messages go to the virtual
console were i started X. 
Cany anyone help?

Thanks in advance
Mark


------------------------------


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