Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #810
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Mon, 14 Mar 94 06:13:07 EST

Linux-Misc Digest #810, Volume #1                Mon, 14 Mar 94 06:13:07 EST

Contents:
  Re: DOOM for X (David Taylor)
  Re: DOOM for X (Rich Murphey)
  Re: HPFS (John Paul Morrison)
  Re: *** DON'T READ THIS BEFORE POSTING *** (Ron Smits)
  Re: "Reverse-engineering" (Ron Smits)
  Re: An idea to cut down noise (Ron Smits)
  Why "xinit:  Unknown error (errno 0):  Client error."? (Ken Neighbors)
  Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering") (Robert Sanders)
  Re: DOOM for X (Terry Lambert)
  Re: DOOM for X (Terry Lambert)
  outbytes.c helps backup Linux (David J Camp)
  Re: Free PCNFS client? (Damien Neil)
  Re: Notebook - PCMCIA (Caroline Andrae)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: ddt@daisy.cc.utexas.edu (David Taylor)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.apps
Subject: Re: DOOM for X
Date: 12 Mar 1994 02:20:07 -0600

The good news: I've been contacted by SGI, DEC, and Sun on ports to
their OS's.  The SGI Indy arrived today.  Neat machine.  An AXP and
SS10 may be on their way.

The bad news: I hope y'all don't mind if I restrict the ports to
keyboard input.  I'm kinda wondering about the rudeness of yanking the
mouse into the window for mouse control.  Would rather not muck with
it.  Real men use keyboards only anyway.. (I'm an incurable vi loser).
The sound may also be sorta medium OK.  My Linux sound code doesn't
sound super hot because Linux as w/ other UNIXes isn't too pleased with
real-time sound scheduling, mixing, modelling, etc.  The effect is a
few sound effects like item-up which sound as though there's a
Katherine Hepburn filter on the output.

Kind of crunched for time at work, now.  The jag ports beckon.

        =-ddt->


------------------------------

From: rich@id.tmc.edu (Rich Murphey)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.apps
Subject: Re: DOOM for X
Date: 12 Mar 1994 09:25:26 GMT
Reply-To: rich@lamprey.utmb.edu

In article <hastyCMJL20.Mr4@netcom.com> hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr) writes:
|From: hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr)
|Xref: bcm comp.os.386bsd.apps:1088 comp.os.linux.misc:11460
|In article <markus.57.00E736E9@rsvl.unisys.com> markus@rsvl.unisys.com (Mark K Vallevand) writes:
|>In article <glen.763349922@paladine> glen@paladine.ece.jcu.edu.au (Glen Harris) writes:
|Well, at least with the S3 801/928,864 we can map the entire cards
|video memory into a user space. Linux (whatever version is at ) can
|can do this --- if memory does not fail me  XFree86 for linux does this.
|
|There was a limitation on FreeBSD which prevented  us from mapping 
|the entire S3's memory. With the latest release of FreeBSD we should
|be able to do it also.

The next binary release of XFree86 for FreeBSD will support memory
mapping the entire frame buffer in user space (the MITSHM extension).

You also need a kernel configured with the SYSVSHM (System V shared
memory) option.  The distributed FreeBSD kernel binaries don't include
it yet, so as it stands you'll have to compile a kernel for it.  Rich
--
`Women, children and the rhythm section first..' -Jaco Pastorius

------------------------------

From: jmorriso@bogomips.ee.ubc.ca (John Paul Morrison)
Subject: Re: HPFS
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 1994 08:14:07 GMT

In article <2928@win.or.jp>, Kinga Yho <g609296@win.or.jp> wrote:
>Andreas Hintermueller (q3932532@bonsai.fernuni-hagen.de) wrote:
>
>>How can I mount OS/2-HPFS-Drives under Linux (pl13) ???
>
>I guess you need pl14 and you need to recompile the e2fsck front end -
>fsck - in order to get it work properly.

or just link /bin/true to /etc/fs/fsck.hpfs (or wherever the hell fsck.* is supposed
to live now)

>--
>
> \ \\/o\             ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~              \ \\/o\
>>===== /             | Barry Yip  Fido  6:730/16.0  |             >===== /
> //// ~              | ^^^^^^^^^  g609296@win.or.jp |              //// ~


-- 
==========================================================================
BogoMIPS Research Labs -- bogosity research & simulation -- VE7JPM -- 
jmorriso@bogomips.ee.ubc.ca                       jmorriso@rflab.ee.ubc.ca 
==========================================================================

------------------------------

From: ron@draconia.hacktic.nl (Ron Smits)
Subject: Re: *** DON'T READ THIS BEFORE POSTING ***
Date: 12 Mar 1994 09:35:55 GMT

Bill Hogan (bhogan@crl.com) wrote:
:   If you have a question, just ask it!

:   (A great scientist was once asked if he had found the answer. "Answers
: are relatively easy", said the Professor, "finding the right question,
: that's the hard part.")

:  <B

I second this wholeheartedly!!!!

:  
: -- 
:   Bill Hogan
: {bhogan@crl.com}

--



                Ron Smits
                ron@draconia.hacktic.nl
                Ron.Smits@Netherlands.NCR.COM

/*-( My opinions are my opinions, My boss's opinions are his opinions )-*/
/*-(                They might not be the same                         -*/


------------------------------

From: ron@draconia.hacktic.nl (Ron Smits)
Subject: Re: "Reverse-engineering"
Date: 12 Mar 1994 09:41:13 GMT

John F. Haugh II (jfh@rpp386) wrote:
: In article <tgmCMG1vp.JoM@netcom.com> tgm@netcom.com (Thomas G. McWilliams) writes:
: As for your claim about various and sundry "subtle" forms of
: economics, I am a professional programmer.  I write operating
: systems for a living.  Expecting me to =stop= writing operating
: systems and start being a CD-ROM distribution company is quite
: unrealistic.  As for companies like Cygnus, their continued
: existence is only proof that people with creative imaginations
: haven't bothered to really screw them just yet.  Try figuring out
: how Cygnus is going to make money doing bug fixes when some customer
: decides to resell (or give away for free ...) those bug fixes.  Now
: how do you expect Cygnus to make its payroll?  More of these creative
: non-monetary economic principals you're thinking of?
: -- 
: John F. Haugh II  [ NRA-ILA ] [ Kill Barney ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
: Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151 [GOP][DoF #17][PADI][ENTJ]   @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
:  There are three documents that run my life: The King James Bible, the United
:  States Constitution, and the UNIX System V Release 4 Programmer's Reference.

--

I wish somebody from Cygnus would comment on this. I cannot imagine they
haven't thought about this

                Ron Smits
                ron@draconia.hacktic.nl
                Ron.Smits@Netherlands.NCR.COM

/*-( My opinions are my opinions, My boss's opinions are his opinions )-*/
/*-(                They might not be the same                         -*/


------------------------------

From: ron@draconia.hacktic.nl (Ron Smits)
Subject: Re: An idea to cut down noise
Date: 12 Mar 1994 09:51:03 GMT

Gregory Owen (gowen@allegro.cs.tufts.edu) wrote:

:       I've been rolling this idea around in my head for a while, and
: while I'm not in a position to do anything about it, I thought I'd
: bring it up and maybe people will like it, and maybe someone will try
: it.

:       As I understand it, on Compuserve there are support forums
: where users ask questions, companies answer them, and answers get
: entered into a question-answer database, so users can refer to the
: database before asking the question.  Now, the largest problem with
: the comp.os.linux groups is the high volume, and tracking down the
: right FAQ is not as simple as most people would like.  So how about a
: linux answer server?

:       Basically, have someone or some group of people monitor the
: comp.os.linux groups, compiling authoritative answers to questions as
: they come, and entering them into a gopher/www accessible database.
: Then all readers can access the database before posting.

:       Now, the first objection is, "Why is this different from a
: FAQ?"  There is so many FAQs and HOWTOs, and they are all so large,
: that for a newbie to track down a question is a large task, and even
: experienced people may want to bother.  But if all the FAQ answers and
: HOWTO subjects were organized into such a database, then Joe User
: could log into the server and query about, say, "mtools",
: "adaptec|scsi", "PPP" or whatever, and get all the pertinent
: information for browsing.  No tracking down which FAQ/HOWTO, no
: finding the right ftp site, no worrying about which version of the FAQ
: it is.

:       Another improvement is timeliness.  Networking questions, for
: example, usually are relevant to the kernel being used.  Net answers
: which are chosen for this database could hopefully also have info on
: which patchlevel/release the answer is for, etc., which will be
: helpful.

:       Three obvious drawbacks suggest themselves, and I'd love to see
: discussion on this.  First, there may be some legal type problem with
: making someone's post available like that.  Aside from the fact that a
: few people treat usenet posts as equivalent to private mail, John
: Expert probably wouldn't want 500 people mailing him because his name
: got in the database.  I'll let net-lawyers argue this one.

:       Secondly, there is the question of correctness.  Just because
: something is posted to the net doesn't make it correct!  But by
: waiting for multiple confirmation, or testing the answers, the
: database compilators could avoid this.  

:       Thirdly, this is obviously a heck of a time sink.  As I said,
: I am unable to do it -- two part time jobs and 4 classes do bad things
: to my time -- but I am posting this because maybe people will see
: merit in the idea, and maybe someone will volunteer.

:       So, I submit this idea for your consideration.  What say you,
: folks?

:   Greg Owen  { gowen@allegro.cs.tufts.edu, gowen@xis.xerox.com }
:  1.01 GCS/GO d++ p+ c++ l++ u++ e+ -m+ s++/- n- h !(f)? g+ -w+ t+ r-- y?
: "Put the staff in my hands; for I go to the Fenians, O cleric, to chaunt/
: The war-songs that roused them of old; they will rise, making clouds..."

--

I like this idea alot!! good thinking (tm). The problem Greg mentions about
the correctness of an answer could e solved by adding a field in the database
that has a percentage correctness based on the number of times the problem
was solved using that answer. We do it like that at work. If a problem
is only solved once with that solution the correctness percentage is low
the more times that solution is successfully applied the percentage rises.

I do see another problem. People who cannot connect to the server because
they are a uucp site. But maybe the mail-server-program-guru's know how
to handle a problem like that.

If this comes to a project, count me in!

                Ron Smits
                ron@draconia.hacktic.nl
                Ron.Smits@Netherlands.NCR.COM

/*-( My opinions are my opinions, My boss's opinions are his opinions )-*/
/*-(                They might not be the same                         -*/


------------------------------

From: wkn@leland.Stanford.EDU (Ken Neighbors)
Subject: Why "xinit:  Unknown error (errno 0):  Client error."?
Date: 14 Mar 1994 07:37:08 GMT

Nothing critical, but why does xinit exit with an error message and
non-zero exit status?  Is something setup wrong--does it do that
for everyone?  (I'm running Slackware 1.1.2, and I type "startx".)

I even get this message when I just type "xinit" and then exit the
xterm.

Thanks
Ken Neighbors
wkn@leland.stanford.edu

------------------------------

From: gt8134b@prism.gatech.EDU (Robert Sanders)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
Subject: Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering")
Date: 14 Mar 94 00:19:14 GMT

jfh@rpp386 (John F. Haugh II) writes:

>>No. You won't get a number in the phone book for GCC support :-) But
>>with little effort you should be able to get one. One question you could
>>ask to the net is: "Where can I get commercial support for GCC?". Try it
>>and see what answers you'll get.

>And if I'm a grocery store with no access to "the net", how do I get
>support?

Funny you should say this: I just took some time off from school and got
a job at Harry's Farmers' Market, which is a grocery store *with* access
to the net.  I guess the answer for us was "get access to the net." :-)
Or, actually, to hire me and help subsidize my education.

--
 _g,  '96 --->>>>>>>>>>   gt8134b@prism.gatech.edu  <<<<<<<<<---  CompSci  ,g_
W@@@W__        |-\      ^        | disclaimer:  <---> "Bow before ZOD!" __W@@@W
W@@@@**~~~'  ro|-<ert s/_\ nders |   who am I???  ^  from Superman  '~~~**@@@@W
`*MV' hi,ocie! |-/ad! /   \ss!!  | ooga ooga!!    |    II (cool)!         `VW*'

------------------------------

From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.apps
Subject: Re: DOOM for X
Date: 14 Mar 1994 02:01:54 GMT

In article <2lrtvn$icf@daisy.cc.utexas.edu> ddt@daisy.cc.utexas.edu (David Taylor) writes:
>The bad news: I hope y'all don't mind if I restrict the ports to
>keyboard input.  I'm kinda wondering about the rudeness of yanking the
>mouse into the window for mouse control.  Would rather not muck with
>it.  Real men use keyboards only anyway.. (I'm an incurable vi loser).

Well, from one "incurable vi loser" to another, I think not doing the
mouse stuff is a big handicap.  With X, you should get focus notification
events and/or enter/leave notify events and be able to deal with then as
needed.

The issue of using it as an input device without grabbing the mouse should
be fairly easy, as there is already a working example of this type of usage
for control in cbzone (the Battle Zone clone).


                                        Terry Lambert
                                        terry@cs.weber.edu
---
Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present
or previous employers.

------------------------------

From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.apps
Subject: Re: DOOM for X
Date: 14 Mar 1994 02:12:58 GMT

In article <SJA.94Mar12174713@gamma.hut.fi> sja@snakemail.hut.fi (Sakari Jalovaara) writes:
]> I agree that X the wrong platform for doing high-speed and
]> time-critical graphics applications like video-style games.  There are
]> extensions (not SHM) that help a little, but there are lots of
]> advantages to taking direct control of the hardware.  The result is
]> _not_ client-server.
]
]To get high speed graphics on X you just need to re-write the server:
]
]       - At program startup, map the X server code into the application
]         program memory space (e.g. as a shared library).
]       - In every Xlib call, check if the display to be accessed is local.
]         If not, send a network X request as usual.
]       - For local displays, call the appropriate routine in the server.
]         The server code should be extended to do appripriate locking
]         for its global data and display hardware.

There are (apparently) several misconceptions here.

(1)     You can't necessarily map memory from the display adapter
        directly.  There is often a "window" which you must use to
        communicate with display memory that would be used instead.

(2)     Not all OS's support the large segment changes, where the
        segment size no longer matches the page size directly to allow
        you to map more than 4k at a time (SVR4 does, though).

(3)     The client/server distinctions are fictional; I have a lab
        full of NCR X terminals (now an AT&T X terminals I guess)
        that support developement and download of clients to run in
        the terminal (server) address space.  Thinking about it a
        minute should convince you that this is the only way to do a
        window manager, and an enlightened programmer would probably
        implement an RPC mechanism for widget drawing the same way
        so that look-n-feel(tm) would rely on which window manager
        got downloaded.

Another issue in most X programs is that the programmers don't know
what defines "fast", or they are too worried about blowing bits to
screen memory directly to do things so they can be fast on remote X
terminals as well.  This is generally reflected by the use of bitmaps
and pixmaps (which must be shoved over the wire and are generally in
ancillary memory in the server) instead of, for instance, fonts, which
are generally stored in a font cache in video memory and can be blitted
into place by a single card function.

It's quite possible to build *fast* X games on relatively low speed
hardware if you do it the right way.


                                        Terry Lambert
                                        terry@cs.weber.edu
---
Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present
or previous employers.

------------------------------

From: david@wubios.wustl.edu (David J Camp)
Subject: outbytes.c helps backup Linux
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 06:16:07 GMT

Here is a program called outbytes.c.  It will allow you to backup your
Linux systems to diskette.  It requires flop and unflop, also included
below.  The command to use this is:

    cd /
    tar cvf - . | outbytes 1457152 /a/backup.tar

Where /a is the directory where your diskette is mounted.  Modify flop
and unflop as needed.  -David-

# david@wubios.wustl.edu             David J. Camp BS MS     ^        #
# david@campfire.stl.mo.us           +1 314 382 0584       < * >      #
# I am a member of:  The League for Programming Freedom.     v        #
# abs (investment#1 - investment#2) << abs (anyinvestment - anydebt)  #

=====  begin of flop =====
mount -t msdos /dev/fd0 /a
===== end of flop =====

===== begin of unflop =====
umount /a
===== end of unflop =====

===== begin of outbytes.c =====
/* outbytes.h -- read n bytes from stdin and write disk, repeatedly. */

#include <stdio.h>

void main (int argc, char * argv [])

{
int inchar;
long counter;
long threshold;
FILE * outfile;
char enter [2];
FILE * tty;

if (argc != 3)
    {
    fprintf (stderr, "usage: outbytes bytes outfile\n");
    fprintf (stderr, "example: outbytes 1457152 /a/backup.tar\n");
    exit (1);
    }
tty = fopen ("/dev/tty", "r+");
sscanf (argv [1], "%ld", &threshold);
system ("flop");
outfile = fopen (argv [2], "w");
counter = 0;
inchar = fgetc (stdin);
while (! feof (stdin))
    {
    fputc (inchar, outfile);
    if (counter ++ > threshold)
        {
        fflush (outfile);
        fclose (outfile);
        system ("sync;unflop");
        fprintf (stderr, "Insert another diskette, and press Enter, please:");
        do
            {
            fgets (enter, 2, tty);
            }
            while (enter [0] != '\n');
        counter = 0;
        system ("flop");
        outfile = fopen (argv [2], "w");
        }
    inchar = fgetc (stdin);
    }
fclose (outfile);
system ("unflop");
}
===== end of outbytes.c =====

------------------------------

From: damien@b63519.student.cwru.edu (Damien Neil)
Subject: Re: Free PCNFS client?
Date: 14 Mar 1994 05:02:08 GMT

In article <240f8827%fidonet.org@p2.f34.n2407.z2.fido.imp.com>,
Peter Berger <pit@p2.lxs.chg.imp.com> wrote:
>esuln@csv.warwick.ac.uk (James Murray) wrote:

> > Thats great but can I get hold of a free PCNFS client?
>That's the prob, here (and on other places) discussed to death (with no result
>afaik)..

From a message on a local newsgroup:

:For anyone interested, there is a shareware DOS NFS client available
:from polyslo.calpoly.edu in /pub/mdurkin/nfs.
:
:The client is currently in beta, but works pretty well.  It has full
:support for pcnfsd and bwnfsd authentication.

I have not used this myself, but you may want to check it out.
-- 
Damien Neil  [MIME OK]   CMPS/EEAP  "Until somebody debugs reality, the best
damien@b63519.student.cwru.edu       I can do is a quick patch here and there."
  dpn2@po.cwru.edu  Case Western Reserve University         - Erik Green

------------------------------

From: andrae@rzdspc2.informatik.uni-hamburg.de (Caroline Andrae)
Crossposted-To: comp.unix.bsd
Subject: Re: Notebook - PCMCIA
Date: 14 Mar 1994 09:41:07 GMT


|> >Have you tried to put your notebook on a network with a PCMCIA ethernet
|> >card?
|> 
|> Works great; all you need is a PCMCIA enabler shim, which is very few lines
|> of code to write, especially if you have doc's for PCMCIA.  Most of the
|> network cards are NE2000 compatible.  Should take you half an hour.
|> 
|> It also works with anything else PCMCIA if you code things right (or one
|> network card exactly if you do it wrong), including FAX modems and SCSI
|> interfaces for things like tape drives.  8-).
|> 
Could you please explain, or post the thing you wrote?

Thanks,

Caroline

-- 
andrae@informatik.uni-hamburg.de                   Caroline Andrae
                                                   Fachbereich Informatik/RO
                                                   Universitaet Hamburg
                                                   Vogt-Koelln-Str. 30
                                                   22527 Hamburg

------------------------------


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