Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #825
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Thu, 17 Mar 94 09:13:11 EST

Linux-Misc Digest #825, Volume #1                Thu, 17 Mar 94 09:13:11 EST

Contents:
  Re: How big is the Linux community? (Marc Fraioli)
  Driver for NEC T130B (Trantor) wanted (TH Merseburg)
  Re: How big is the Linux community? (Grant Edwards)
  Re: When is the next Slackware coming? (Grant Edwards)
  Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering") (John F. Haugh II)
  Re: Opinions wanted about SCO-unix (vs AIX/Linux). (John F. Haugh II)
  Re: Problems with Linux 1.0 (Charles Hedrick)
  Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering") (Joachim Schrod)
  Re: Upgradability? (khockenb@vaxc.stevens-tech.edu)
  Re: Linux and Hayes 28,800's - anyone have them? (Pat St. Jean)
  Re: Version 1.0 (Peter Dalgaard SFE)
  Linux Journal in UK? (was Re: Linux Journal (Geoff Lane)
  Re: Linux 1.0 comes out on same day Apple announces new machines (Bouwmeester)
  PHIGS on Linux? (Hank Harris)
  Linux Journal Information (Linux Journal)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: mjf@clark.net (Marc Fraioli)
Subject: Re: How big is the Linux community?
Date: 16 Mar 1994 23:35:56 GMT
Reply-To: mjf@clark.net

In article jkt@news.belwue.de, andreas@orion.mgen.uni-heidelberg.de (Andreas Helke) writes:
>zachary brown (zbrown@lynx.dac.neu.edu) wrote:
>: These newsgroups are like windows into a world we can't enter.
>
>: What efforts are being made, if any, to find out how many computers are
>: running linux? I heard something awhile ago about sending mail somewhere
>: to be counted. How is that going (and how do I sign into it)?
>
>I think one of the best figures is the estimated number of readers
>of the comp.os.linux tree appearing in news.lists. This was about
>70000 when I last looked some months ago. Probably almost every reader
>is using linux and these represent only a part of the Linux community.

Well, I would dispute this.  I know I read the newsgroups for about 4 months
before getting Linux myself, just to see what people were thinking about it.
Of course, I use it now...

>I know several people who use Linux but do not read the news. The
>email counter has currently about 5000 entrys. This is less than 5 %
>of the Linux users. The statistics of the counter give hints how Linux
>use is distributed over the world, but it does not give a hint about 
>the size of the Linux community. 
>
That I'll agree with.  I haven't registered anything.

---
Marc Fraioli          |         HAIL ANTS!
mjf@clark.net         | 


------------------------------

From: thmers@server1.rz.uni-leipzig.de (TH Merseburg)
Subject: Driver for NEC T130B (Trantor) wanted
Date: 17 Mar 1994 09:22:48 +0100

Is there anywhere a driver for the trantor compatible NEC T130B SCSI-controller
available. Where can I ftp'ing it.

Please send an answer with e-mail to:

pietsch@mailserv.hrz.th-merseburg.de or post it to this group.

Best regards

Dieter Pietsch
-- 
| Dirk Hube                 | X.400:c=de;a=d400;p=th-merseburg;ou=hrz;s=hube |
| TH Merseburg              | RFC 822: hube@hrz.th-merseburg.d400.de         |
| Geusaer Strasse, HRZ      | SMTP: hube@mailserv.hrz.th-merseburg.de        |
| 06217 Merseburg           | phone: +49 3461 46 2979                        |

------------------------------

From: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Subject: Re: How big is the Linux community?
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 22:34:29 GMT

zachary brown (zbrown@lynx.dac.neu.edu) wrote:

: These newsgroups are like windows into a world we can't enter.

Whaaaat?

: What efforts are being made, if any, to find out how many computers
: are running linux? I heard something awhile ago about sending mail
: somewhere to be counted. How is that going (and how do I sign into
: it)?

There is a Linux-counter system to which people send e-mail to
register their Linux systems.  I don't know what the current count
is, but it gets posted pretty regularly.

: I know that FTP sites take e-mail addresses as passwords and log all
: file transfers with that address. Why not just count each e-mail
: address once if it has downloaded the linux A series? If the various
: mirrors got together on it, a practical estimate could be
: established.

What about the people who order CD's and floppy sets from
distributors, and then hand those around to their friends.  What about
people who download several distributions and only end up installing
one?

: I'd be interested to know how many subscriptions the Linux Journal
: has received, and if they're still pouring in.

: Linux, the internet, GNU, fire departments and libraries are good.

You forgot to mention air-conditioning and showers -- which with the
addition of public libraries are the three greatest accomplishments of
human civilization.

--
Grant Edwards                                 |Yow!  I'm using my X-RAY
Rosemount Inc.                                |VISION to obtain a rare
                                              |glimpse of the INNER WORKINGS
grante@rosemount.com                          |of this POTATO!!

------------------------------

From: grante@aquarius.rosemount.com (Grant Edwards)
Subject: Re: When is the next Slackware coming?
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 22:40:34 GMT

Bob Myers (bmyers@dseg.ti.com) wrote:

: I asked Pat that the other day...

: He's working on getting all of the packages together now, so i'd think
: that maybe sometime soon.

: -bob

: p.s.  I think I'd wait if I were you...instead of loading 1.1.2 up now.

On the other hand, X11 and the kernel are both very easy to update
(I've done X11 once, and the kernel a half-dozen times).  For X11, you
just untar some files, then set up one symbolic link and you're done.
The kernel is pretty easy also: untar the files, make config, make
dep, make zImage, run lilo/install.

Besides, everybody should know how to compile the kernel.  At some
point you will probably have to recompile the kernel to get your
hardware working juuust right, and it's best to learn how before you
really have to.

--
Grant Edwards                                 |Yow!  Once, there was NO
Rosemount Inc.                                |fun...  This was before MENU
                                              |planning, FASHION statements
grante@rosemount.com                          |or NAUTILUS equipment...
                                              |Then, in 1985..  FUN was
                                              |completely encoded in this
                                              |tiny MICROCHIP..  It contain
                                              |14,768 vaguely amusing
                                              |SIT-COM pilots!!  We had to
                                              |wait FOUR BILLION years but
                                              |we finally got JERRY LEWIS,
                                              |MTV and a large selection of
                                              |creme-filled snack cakes!

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
From: jfh@rpp386 (John F. Haugh II)
Subject: Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering")
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 1994 06:59:07 GMT

In article <2m4ahq$kl1@rs18.hrz.th-darmstadt.de> schrod@iti.informatik.th-darmstadt.de (Joachim Schrod) writes:
>That is plain false.
>
>To wit:
>
>       IBM support
>       
>       CREATED=92/03/17 OPENED=92/03/27 CLOSED=92/07/06
>       ERROR DESCRIPTION:
>           the function prototype for fchmod() in the include file
>           /usr/include/sys/stat.h is incorrect. the first parameter should
>           be a file descriptor (int) not a string (char *).
>       LOCAL FIX:
>       PROBLEM SUMMARY:
>           our current update scheme doesn't allow us to update header
>           files.  therefore,  we will not ship this change.
>       PROBLEM CONCLUSION:
>           changes will not be shipped.
>       TEMPORARY FIX:
>           customer can edit the file themselves.  change the first
>           parameter of the fchmod call to (int) instead of (char *).
>       
>A well known bug for IBM -- try to get a fix into the next AIX release...

Uh, looks like you got an answer.  You may not LIKE the answer, but
that's the one you got.

In this particular instance, changing <sys/stat.h> would require that
virtually the entire system be re-shipped.  The reason is that you
cannot determine automatically if the change to <sys/stat.h> was the
only cause of the module being recompiled (and thus you can ignore it)
or if something else changed and this is what caused the re-compilation.

As regards the regex problem, I'm not as familiar with its life story
as I am with this particular header file bug.  I do believe that the
problem is more complex than you want to claim.  I do know that the
average time from a fix being reported to a fix being delivered is
well under half a year, and that 70% of all calls to the support
center are handled on the original call.  I don't know what the ratios
are going into the back end, but I can tell you that a problem which
isn't a "bug" and which is still around after more than 3 days is
considered to be "real old".  If it is a bug, you will (85% of the time
or better) have a fix in your hands in something like 6 to 8 weeks.
By the time you work out all the percentages, the avergae call to fix
in hand times are in terms of days, not weeks or months.
-- 
John F. Haugh II  [ NRA-ILA ] [ Kill Barney ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151 [GOP][DoF #17][PADI][ENTJ]   @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
 There are three documents that run my life: The King James Bible, the United
 States Constitution, and the UNIX System V Release 4 Programmer's Reference.

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.unix.advocacy,biz.sco.general
From: jfh@rpp386 (John F. Haugh II)
Subject: Re: Opinions wanted about SCO-unix (vs AIX/Linux).
Reply-To: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org (John F. Haugh II)
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 1994 07:04:09 GMT

In article <Mario.Eduardo.13.000C52CA@vu-wien.ac.at> Mario.Eduardo@vu-wien.ac.at (Mario EDUARDO) writes:
>it is very simple to determine the quality of the SCO system :
>
>get some public domain software (gnu cpio, gnu tar, gnu sed, inn, sendmail, 
>various tcp daemons) and try to compile it. it was  a lot of work to compile 
>GCPIO on ODT 1.1.0, and because of the compatibility ODT 1 to ODT 2 to ODT 3
>it is lost time to try it on ODT 3. 

Try running anything that is set-UID root on SCO UNIX.  Try running any
tools (like Shadow ;-) that "know" about the mainstream organization of
I&A info.  Yum, yum.
-- 
John F. Haugh II  [ NRA-ILA ] [ Kill Barney ] !'s: ...!cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!jfh
Ma Bell: (512) 251-2151 [GOP][DoF #17][PADI][ENTJ]   @'s: jfh@rpp386.cactus.org
 There are three documents that run my life: The King James Bible, the United
 States Constitution, and the UNIX System V Release 4 Programmer's Reference.

------------------------------

From: hedrick@geneva.rutgers.edu (Charles Hedrick)
Subject: Re: Problems with Linux 1.0
Date: 17 Mar 94 05:21:57 GMT

ptomblin@gandalf.ca (Paul Tomblin) writes:

>I'm pretty sure ifconfig and route both say exactly the same things they did
>under pl14f.  I didn't change anything in the /etc directory.

That could be a problem.  Somewhere around pl15 a change was made that
requires extra route commands.  I am sending via email my route
FAQ.  (I'm not posting it since I justed posted it a few days
ago.)

------------------------------

From: schrod@iti.informatik.th-darmstadt.de (Joachim Schrod)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss
Subject: Re: compiler quality (was "Reverse-engineering")
Date: 17 Mar 1994 10:49:27 GMT

In article <1994Mar17.065907.847@rpp386>, jfh@rpp386 (John F. Haugh II) writes:
> In article <2m4ahq$kl1@rs18.hrz.th-darmstadt.de> schrod@iti.informatik.th-darmstadt.de (Joachim Schrod) writes:
> >That is plain false.
> >
> >To wit:
> >
> >     [... known bug in AIX include files that will not be fixed by IBM...]
> >     
> >A well known bug for IBM -- try to get a fix into the next AIX release...
> 
> Uh, looks like you got an answer.  You may not LIKE the answer, but
> that's the one you got.

What's the term you US folks use for misleading citations?

Just to repeat the text that triggered my article:

> >John> I don't know which companies you've been dealing with, but if you
> >John> call IBM and the bug is known, you can get a set of update
> >John> floppies in your hand in under 24 hours.
> >
> >What if the bug is not known ?
> 
> Then you get the fix 24 hours after it's made.

I don't want an answer -- I want a *fix*.

Oh, but I have to change my sentence from above: Your statement is
_not_ just plain wrong, it's just plain cynical. Of course I get a
fix 24 hours after it's made -- that makes 24 hours after eternity...

Regards,
        Joachim

--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Joachim Schrod                  Email: schrod@iti.informatik.th-darmstadt.de
Computer Science Department
Technical University of Darmstadt, Germany

------------------------------

From: khockenb@vaxc.stevens-tech.edu
Subject: Re: Upgradability?
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 15:41:16 GMT

In article <1994Mar15.080523.24179@lulea.trab.se>, anders@lulea.trab.se (Anders Eriksson) writes:
> I too have waited for the 1.0 release and now the question arise: How do I
> know when the distributions are updated with the new kernel?

You watch comp.os.linux.announce for the announcement.

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Linux and Hayes 28,800's - anyone have them?
From: stjeanp@brazil-nut (Pat St. Jean)
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 16:19:39 GMT

i can get zoom 28.8 modems (external with fax) for 250 plus shipping...
i didn't really want to plug myself here, but I also don't want to see people
get ripped off somewhere else too...sorry if it isn't the place for it.
If anyone is interested please let me know...thanks!
Once again, it isn't my intention to use this group to make money, i'm just
trying to keep you all from getting robbed.

--Pat
===========================================================================
Pat St. Jean                                          stjeanp@math.enmu.edu
            Eastern New Mexico University Systems Administrator
===========================================================================
        Linux developer who is more than willing to pay for programs
              if by doing so I can encourage more development.
===========================================================================

------------------------------

From: pd@kubism.ku.dk (Peter Dalgaard SFE)
Subject: Re: Version 1.0
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 1994 15:39:45 GMT

In <2m5cng$5bv@ftp.health.org> nathan@ftp.health.org (Nathan Bardsley) writes:

>In article <2m55uh$dr0@cmcl2.nyu.edu>, liuyu <liuyu@acf2.nyu.edu> wrote:
>>joslyn@benji.Colorado.EDU (Christopher Joslyn) writes:
>>
>>  I just dl v1.0.  But the question is how do I compile it?  I also
>>checked the slackware. It is still 0.99.  Do I have to wait until
>>slackware compiles them?  
>>BTW, I have a empty computer that needs a OS.

>Yes.  As everybody knows, [...snide remarks deleted]

>0.  Get and read the HOWTOs, and the LDP books.  

I suspect you forgot a minor point:

-1. Install current slackware. Play around.

(Don't overestimate the knowledge of obvious newbies. How was
he supposed to know that slackware is a full development 
system?)
--
   O_   ---- Peter Dalgaard
  c/ /'  --- Statistical Research Unit
 ( ) \( ) -- University of Copenhagen
~~~~~~~~~~ - (pd@kubism.ku.dk)

------------------------------

From: zzassgl@cs6400.mcc.ac.uk (Geoff Lane)
Subject: Linux Journal in UK? (was Re: Linux Journal
Date: 17 Mar 1994 08:46:56 -0000

Is anyone distributing the Linux Journal in the UK?

--
Geoff. Lane. | Internet: zzassgl@cs6400.mcc.ac.uk | Janet: zzassgl@uk.ac.mcc
CS6400 Sys Admin, Manchester Computing Centre, Oxford Rd,  Manchester, M13 9PL

Be wary of strong drink.  It can make you shoot at tax collectors and miss.
                                      -- Lazarus Long, "Time Enough for Love"

------------------------------

From: bouwmees@dutian.twi.tudelft.nl (Bouwmeester)
Subject: Re: Linux 1.0 comes out on same day Apple announces new machines
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 1994 08:47:54 GMT

entropy@world.std.com (Lawrence Foard) writes:

>In article <14MAR199417503194@rigel.tamu.edu>,
>Gerard R. Lazo <grl6732@rigel.tamu.edu> wrote:
>>I overheard on NPR that Apple announced their new line of PowerPC
>>computers today. It was touted that the prices/performance challenged
>>Intel's Pentium. I thought it was ironic, coincidental, interesting
>>that Linux 1.0 would make its debut on the same day. With all the
>>applications that can be ported to Linux, it will be interesting to
>>see how the different OS environments evolve.

>Now lets get Linux ported to the Power PC before Windows NT :)

Is there somebody out there working on a port? Are there any volunteers (yes,
I'm volunteering to help with a port to the Power PC)?

Regards, 
        Leon


+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Leon Bouwmeester           Delft University of Technology                   | 
|Phone : +31-(0)15-783588   Dept. of Applied Mathematics and Computer Science|
|Fax   : +31-(0)15-787141   Julianalaan 132, 2628 BL, Delft                  |
|E-mail: L.H.A.Bouwmeester@twi.tudelft.nl                                    | 
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|" Monday is a day designed to add depression to an otherwise happy week "   |
|  -- Garfield                                                               |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
-- 
+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|Leon Bouwmeester           Delft University of Technology                   | 
|Phone : +31-(0)15-783588   Dept. of Applied Mathematics and Computer Science|
|Fax   : +31-(0)15-787141   Julianalaan 132, 2628 BL, Delft                  |

------------------------------

From: gt0609d@prism.gatech.EDU (Hank Harris)
Subject: PHIGS on Linux?
Date: 16 Mar 94 23:29:26 GMT


   Is PHIGS supported by XFree on Linux?

Thanks in advance,
Hank Harris
gt0609d@acme.gatech.edu

--
Vernon Henry Harris IV
Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta Georgia, 30332
uucp:     ...!{decvax,hplabs,ncar,purdue,rutgers}!gatech!prism!gt0609d
Internet: gt0609d@prism.gatech.edu

------------------------------

From: linux@fylz.com (Linux Journal)
Subject: Linux Journal Information
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 14:58:03 GMT

This message is to let people know the current status of Linux Journal.
If you need more information, send e-mail to linux@fylz.com or
call any of the contact numbers at the end of this message.

Issue #1 Status
==============
Issue #1 of Linux Journal was mailed on February 18 for US subscribers,
Febuary 24 for non-US.  It is 48-pages, process color on some of the pages
and generally looks pretty serious.  Perfect, no, but the comments we
have received indicate we are on the right track.

If you are a subscriber and have not received your copy, let us know.
Between this office (Seattle), the office that maintains the subscription
list (Westport, CT) and the printer/mailer (Burlington, VT) it certainly
is possible that something got lost.  And this list doesn't even include
what the post office might have done with it. :-)

Future Issues
=============
Issue #2 has become the April/May issue.  This is to help us catch up.
(To get decent newsstand distribution issues need to reach these newsstands
in advance of the cover date.)

This issue will be 56 pages and will be mailed by April 5.  Hopefully we
will then be on schedule for our intended monthly publication.

Uniforum
========
Linux Journal (and New York Unix--also from the same publisher) will be
at Uniforum on March 23-25 in San Francisco's Moscone Center.  If you are
going to be there drop by and say hi.  Our booth number is 3515.

Linux and Bookstores
====================
Computer Literacy Bookstore (three locations in Silicon Valley and one
in Washington, DC) now carries Linux Journal as well as SSC's printed
version of Matt Welsh's _Linux Installation and Getting Started_. Stop by
one of their stores or their booth at Uniforum and show them that people
are interested in Linux.

Subscriptions and Issue #1
==========================
Yes, we still have copies of issue #1 left but, as the mail mailing has
gone out it costs us a lot to send it out.  If you want to subscribe
and get issue #1, send us $24 (instead of $19) and you will get a 13-issue
subscription with issue #1 mailed immediately via first class mail.

See you at Uniforum, Phil Hughes, Editor


+--------------+
|    Linux     |    P.O. Box 85867 * Seattle, WA * 98145-1867 * USA
|   Journal    |  (206)524-8338 * fax: (206)526-0803 * linux@fylz.com
+--------------+


           General Information as of January 13, 1994


The purpose of this info sheet is to let you know the current
status of Linux Journal.

Linux Journal is a monthly publication covering the Linux
Community.  The first issue will be available in February, 1994.

Editorial:
Phil Hughes is Editor of Linux Journal. He can be reached at the
West Coast office at the address and numbers indicated on this
letterhead. He can also be contacted via E-mail at phil@fylz.com.

Linux Journal is actively seeking articles on various Linux-
related topics. You can send queries to Phil at this address or
just indicate your interest in writing for Linux Journal.

Advertising:
Joanne Wagner is the Linux Journal advertising representative.
She can be reached at the address and numbers above or contacted
via E-mail at joanne@fylz.com.

If you have a product that you feel is of interest to the Linux
community, call, write or FAX Joanne and request a rate card.
Also, feel free to send press releases to our west coast office.

Subscriptions:
Subscriptions and other requests are handled by our East Coast
office where Robert Young is our publisher. (Bob also publishes
New York Unix.) Subscriptions are $19/year anywhere on the
planet.  Payment can be made using VISA, MasterCard or American
Express (make sure you include the credit card number, expiration
date and signature). We can also accept checks in U.S. dollars.
If you have a question concerning appropriate method of payment,
phone or FAX our subscription numbers or send e-mail to
      subscriptions@fylz.com For security reasons we discourage
sending credit card numbers via e-mail.

       Send subscriptions orders to:
           Linux Journal
           P.O. Box 3364
           Westport, CT 06880-8364
       or FAX them to (203) 454-2582. You can also place
subscription
       orders via phone by calling (800) 546-7274 in the US or
       +1 203 454-3242 elsewhere.


-- 
Linux Journal -- The magazine of, for and about the Linux Community
P.O. Box 85867, Seattle, WA 98145-1867 USA
E-mail: linux@fylz.com   Phone: +1 206 524 8338 FAX: +1 206 526 0803

------------------------------


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